Latest revision as of 19:33, 24 January 2011

Attendees

People present (lines said)

jlaska (114)
adamw (29)
kparal (27)
fenrus02 (14)
lmacken (5)
wwoods (2)
Southern_Gentlem (1)
Cerlyn (1)
Viking-Ice (1)

Unable to attend:

Rhe (hopefully sleeping)
Hongqing (hopefully sleeping)

Agenda

Previous meeting follow-up

adamw - follow-up on advisory-board thread on media requirements for spins (http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/advisory-board/2011-January/010271.html).
Bodhi feedback patch from fcami (see infrastructure ticket#701 awaiting review

reviewed and accepted, yay! Thanks lmacken!

Adjusting proventesters group to be invite-only

Summary: Some testers are applying to the FAS proventesters group, but not filing a ticket or sending a welcome email (see http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/test/2011-January/096511.html); One suggestion is to make proventesters invite-only, and reflect the change in the Proven_tester documentation

ticket (jlaska, 16:26:21)

Group discussed and decided to update wiki documentation to clarify process for handling join requests w/o a ticket; If we are flooded with FAS requests w/o a ticket, we will reconsider invite-only recommendation
Next steps ...

ACTION: jlaska - update https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Proven_tester#Mentoring_process with information about how to handle FAS group requests without a corresponding

Latest and greatest on autoqa-0.4.4

Owner: kparal
Summary: new_koji_watcher and depcheck branch were reviewed; Together with the review of new_koji_watcher branch we have found a bug in Bodhi where it incorrectly used -pending tags on certain packages. lmacken quickly created a patch, which should be pushed into production soon (see https://fedorahosted.org/bodhi/changeset/d6218003bda6ce41f85d1a71260aa4152ec63b41); jlaska fixed issues that prevented autotest from building on Fedora 14
Next steps ...: Continue working towards autoqa-0.4.4 milestone

Wiki and Nitrate TCMS - Move to next step (ticket#152)

Owner: rhe
Summary: See fedora-qa ticket#152 (Tcms_use_cases and Tcms_Comparison); Wiki use cases and feature comparison called for final review last week.; Based on the comments, I modified the requirements and moved previous to formal pages below:
Next steps ...

Identify Must-Have + Nice-to-Have feature to find any feature gaps we'd need from Nitrate. Such features will firstly be marked in the comparison table[2], and then summarized in a separate page for reference. Comments welcome!
Write scripts for importing xml files from wiki to nitrate. The xml files exported from wiki has different format from the files to be imported to nitrate, therefore, scripts are needed to do the conversion. Volunteers are welcomed!

Thu, Jan 27 Test Day -- Network device naming

Owner

Narendra

Summary

fedora-qa ticket#159

Wiki looking good ... many thanks to Narendar & Dell for preparation (see https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Day:2011-01-27_Network_Device_Naming_With_Biosdevname)

Blog announcements

Next steps ...

jlaska will upload a script provided by Narendra to help participants determine if they have applicable hardware
HELP: Spread the word -- Test Day this week -- Thu 27, 2011

Open discussion - <Your topic here>

Action items

jlaska - update https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Proven_tester#Mentoring_process with information about how to handle FAS group requests without a corresponding ticket

IRC Transcript

jlaska	#startmeeting Fedora QA Meeting	16:00
zodbot	Meeting started Mon Jan 24 16:00:12 2011 UTC. The chair is jlaska. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.	16:00
zodbot	Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.	16:00
jlaska	#meetingname fedora-qa	16:00
zodbot	The meeting name has been set to 'fedora-qa'	16:00
jlaska	#topic Gathering ...	16:00
jlaska	Show of electronic hands for the fedora-qa meeting ...	16:00
adamw	yo!	16:00
* Southern_Gentlem		16:00
jlaska	howdy adamw Southern_Gentlem	16:01
Cerlyn	here	16:01
* kparal here		16:01
jlaska	greetings Cerlyn + kparal	16:01
* fenrus02 waves		16:02
jlaska	howdy fenrus02	16:02
jlaska	anyone else want to say hello to the logs?	16:02
jlaska	kparal: is jskladan still under the weather today?	16:03
kparal	jlaska: I have no word of him	16:03
jlaska	okay ... I hope he is well	16:04
jlaska	shall we get started ... any stragglers can join during the meeting	16:05
jlaska	#topic Previous meeting follow-up	16:06
jlaska	#info fcami's bodhi patch was reviewed and accepted, thanks lmacken!	16:06
* lmacken will push it to production "this week"		16:07
jlaska	#info follow-up on advisory-board thread on media requirements for spins (http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/advisory-board/2011-January/010271.html)	16:07
fenrus02	and there was much rejoicing :)	16:07
jlaska	lmacken: sweet, thanks	16:07
jlaska	I haven't followed up on the multi-dvd requirements discussion ... we had an open request for feedback on that I think	16:07
jlaska	I should have figured ... looking at the thread, I see adamw all over it	16:08
fenrus02	jlaska, from what i have read, most of your requirements already work	16:08
* adamw away, call of nature		16:09
jlaska	anything else on this topic?	16:09
* jlaska takes silence as a no		16:10
jlaska	#topic Wiki and Nitrate TCMS - Move to next step (ticket#152)	16:10
jlaska	You probably saw some mails on this topic last week	16:10
jlaska	Hurry sent an update to the list and asked to raise this topic during the meeting	16:11
jlaska	#link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Tcms_use_cases	16:11
jlaska	#link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Tcms_Comparison	16:11
jlaska	#info Based on the comments, I modified the requirements and moved to the more formal wiki pages	16:11
jlaska	As for next steps ...	16:12
jlaska	#info Next step ... Identify Must-Have + Nice-to-Have features to find any feature gaps we'd need from Nitrate. Such features will firstly be marked in the comparison table[2], and then summarized in a separate page for reference.	16:12
jlaska	#info Next step ... Write scripts for importing xml files from wiki to nitrate. The xml files exported from wiki has different format from the files to be imported to nitrate, therefore, scripts are needed to do the conversion. Volunteers are welcomed!	16:12
adamw	sorry sorry	16:13
jlaska	And just a general comment ...	16:13
jlaska	#help Anyone interested in helping to understand our current QA wiki workflows, identifying TCMS requirements or exploring/deploying a nitrate staging instance is encouraged to help	16:14
jlaska	adamw: no worries ... nature has all of our phone numbers	16:14
jlaska	any questions comments on this subject?	16:14
adamw	i think for most people it's hard to interact with until there's a test instance up	16:15
jlaska	yeah, I suspect that will solicit a lot of feedback	16:15
jlaska	use cases and requirements are important, but difficult to encourage contributions	16:15
jlaska	at least, that's my impression	16:15
jlaska	I mentioned to Hurry that I could submit a RFR to infrastructure for a test instance ... but I may have missed the response	16:16
jlaska	I'll double check with her on that	16:16
* jlaska makes note		16:16
jlaska	okay ... changing topics ...	16:17
jlaska	#topic Adjusting proventesters group to be invite-only	16:17
jlaska	Mike Cloaked pointed out on the list that there was a gap in our proventester sign-up procedure	16:17
* jlaska finds link		16:17
jlaska	#link http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/test/2011-January/096511.html	16:18
jlaska	The problem is that the FAS group is open for anyone to request membership ... but the documented procedure requires saying hello using a ticket to fedora-qa	16:18
jlaska	(which is sent to test@)	16:18
adamw	well, we have the same issue with bugzappers	16:18
jlaska	I thought nirik had a fine solution for this ... which was to make the FAS group invite-only	16:18
adamw	usually we (bugzappers moderators) just manually clean up the bad requests once in a while	16:18
adamw	that works too, i guess	16:19
jlaska	Reading the feedback on the agenda ... Viking-Ice seemed a bit upset about the idea	16:19
fenrus02	adamw, "once in a while" == daily remove any that sat for 7 days.	16:19
jlaska	I believe the concern was we were putting up barriers to joining the group	16:19
fenrus02	emailing test@ with an introduction hardly seems like a barrier?	16:20
jlaska	that was my take as well	16:20
jlaska	having a group where anyone can click to become a member, but not doing anything ... seems silly	16:21
jlaska	but I could be wrong	16:21
fenrus02	no sponsor that way ... trouble	16:21
adamw	well, we're not _approving_ those requests	16:21
fenrus02	at the very least, folks should receive a "welcome package" that includes proper ways to do things	16:21
adamw	what we could do with them is email the applicants and say 'hey, can you please complete the process properly'	16:21
jlaska	right	16:21
fenrus02	adamw, for bz, i do exactly that.	16:22
adamw	me too	16:22
jlaska	that's another option	16:22
jlaska	do we want to make a recommendation here?	16:22
adamw	so yeah, in theory, we may lose some people if we make the group invite-only and they're hard of reading	16:22
adamw	they may go 'duhh...it doesn't work' and give up, rather than figuring out the right process	16:22
adamw	hard to be sure, though.	16:22
jlaska	as long as the manual responses to these requests are in the single digits ... if we have 100's people applying without going through the process	16:23
jlaska	I don't see anything wrong with making proventesters invite-only at that point	16:23
jlaska	so who scrubs this list ... proventester admins?	16:24
adamw	yeah	16:24
fenrus02	jlaska, some sponsor	16:24
adamw	as a side-note, we figured out that it's good to BCC the other admins when you do one	16:24
adamw	so other admins know it's been taken care of	16:24
jlaska	that was going to be my questoin	16:24
adamw	there's an alias to use	16:24
jlaska	question	16:24
fenrus02	foo-sponsors@fp.o is the format for the alias	16:24
jlaska	should I document this on https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Proven_tester#Mentoring_process	16:25
jlaska	or does this fall under 'common-sense' category?	16:25
adamw	erf, probably better to write it down	16:25
adamw	i see that bus a-comin'	16:25
fenrus02	jlaska, please add to the wiki page	16:25
jlaska	yeah :)	16:25
fenrus02	jlaska, otherwise folks will "forget"	16:25
jlaska	alright, I'll add some content and send out to the wiki	16:25
jlaska	#action jlaska - update https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Proven_tester#Mentoring_process with information about how to handle FAS group requests without a corresponding ticket	16:26
jlaska	does this also mean -1 from everyone for the proposal to make the FAS group invite-only?	16:26
jlaska	fenrus02: adamw: ?	16:27
jlaska	I assume so ... just clarifying	16:27
adamw	yeah, for now	16:28
adamw	as you said, if we're not coping with the manual process, we can re-visit it	16:28
fenrus02	jlaska, i am missing how a trac ticket becomes a barrier. it requires a FAS login, same as clicking 'add'. We should have a "dont click invite, submit trac ticket for invite" message	16:28
jlaska	#info decided to update wiki documentation to clarify process for handling join requests w/o a ticket	16:29
jlaska	fenrus02: yeah, the thread outlined some nice-to-have features for FAS ... but I'm leaving that out of this meeting	16:29
jlaska	#topic Better living through automation ... autoqa	16:30
jlaska	kparal: have a few moments to walk us through the latest'n'greatest?	16:30
kparal	sure	16:30
* kparal opening his notes		16:30
kparal	this time it's very brief, don't be afraid. the last week's changes:	16:31
kparal	#info new_koji_watcher and depcheck branch were reviewed	16:31
kparal	Some issues were raised, jskladan and wwoods are working on addressing them.	16:31
jlaska	ooh ... kudos for meetbot commands! :D	16:31
wwoods	I should have a new patch for review later today	16:31
kparal	great	16:32
wwoods	actually I guess I can send it right now	16:32
kparal	jskladan unfortunately seems to be sick or something	16:32
kparal	next...	16:32
kparal	#info Together with the review of new_koji_watcher branch we have found a bug in Bodhi where it incorrectly used -pending tags on certain packages. lmacken quickly created a patch, which should be pushed into production soon.	16:32
kparal	#link https://fedorahosted.org/bodhi/changeset/d6218003bda6ce41f85d1a71260aa4152ec63b41	16:32
kparal	I have no estimate when it should be in production, lmacken here?	16:33
kparal	nevermind	16:33
kparal	and the last one:	16:33
lmacken	this week, definitely	16:33
lmacken	maybe today	16:33
kparal	ah, great	16:33
kparal	lmacken: do you also plan to clean up those package that will have incorrect tags?	16:34
kparal	*that have	16:34
lmacken	kparal: yeah, I think I already added the corresponding checks to my sanity checking code for it	16:34
kparal	great	16:34
kparal	thanks lmacken	16:34
lmacken	np	16:35
kparal	and lastly:	16:35
kparal	#info jlaska fixed issues that prevented autotest from building on Fedora 14	16:35
kparal	That means latest autotest is finally available for Fedora 14 machines, hooray.	16:35
* jlaska had help from lmr		16:35
kparal	kudos to lmr too	16:36
kparal	ok, that's the last week in a nutshell	16:36
jlaska	kparal: thanks for the updates ... anything else you wanted to highlight for next steps?	16:36
* Viking-Ice joins in late fracking Spain opened a can of whoopass on our team		16:38
kparal	well, we have a lot of big changes and we want to do a new release. that means we will make sure it works ok -- lot of testing	16:38
kparal	or at least a little :-)	16:38
jlaska	kparal: sounds good! :)	16:38
jlaska	Viking-Ice: welcome	16:38
jlaska	okay ... last topic I had on the agenda ...	16:39
jlaska	#topic Thu, Jan 27 Test Day -- Network device naming	16:39
jlaska	#link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Day:2011-01-27_Network_Device_Naming_With_Biosdevname	16:39
jlaska	I think we're looking pretty good on this event from a preparation perspective	16:39
jlaska	the wiki and test cases look good to me	16:40
adamw	yeah, me too	16:40
adamw	if people could spread the word this week it'd be good	16:40
adamw	i'll try and get things out to a few news outlets as this definitely has a potential wider audience	16:40
jlaska	Narendra outlined some tests they wanted to run that would need a rawhide boot.iso ... I'll be pulling down a new lorax from mgracik and will try to pungi up some images shortly	16:40
jlaska	adamw: awesome, thanks	16:40
jlaska	Dell has done a lot of prep for this event ... I'm pretty impressed	16:40
adamw	yeah, and they've been very interactive	16:41
jlaska	cool seeing this type of interaction	16:41
jlaska	almost like someone wrote a really nice SOP for this	16:41
jlaska	gosh ... let me thank that person when I see him or her	16:41
adamw	haha	16:42
jlaska	Narendra sent me a script that participants can run to determine whether they have affected hardware	16:42
adamw	yay! my word is their command	16:42
jlaska	I'll upload that to the wiki shortly and add links to hte page	16:42
jlaska	adamw: operation colada continues	16:42
adamw	where's that jimmy buffett cd	16:42
jlaska	I threw it away, many years ago	16:43
jlaska	okay folks ... it's that time again ...	16:43
* jlaska adds a few meetbot comments first		16:43
jlaska	#info jlaska will upload a script provided by Narendra to help participants determine if they have applicable hardware	16:43
jlaska	#info Wiki looking good ... many thanks to Narendar & Dell for preparation	16:44
jlaska	#help Spread the word -- Test Day this week -- Thu 27, 2011	16:44
jlaska	#topic Open discussion - <Your topic here>	16:45
jlaska	alright ... open discussion time	16:45
jlaska	any takers?	16:45
* jlaska sets the fuse at 2 minutes		16:46
jlaska	#topic Next meeting	16:46
fenrus02	fireworks display?	16:46
jlaska	fenrus02: excellent idea! :)	16:46
jlaska	Just a heads up ... I likely won't be online for the meeting next week	16:46
jlaska	I'm happy to send topics to the list on Friday again ... and if anyone is around and wants to drive ... please feel free to	16:47
jlaska	and remember ... #meetbot is your friend	16:47
jlaska	#info jlaska won't be available for next week meeting (FUDCon)	16:47
jlaska	#info Will send topics to the list this week ... anyone welcome to host the meeting next week	16:47
jlaska	#topic Open discussion - <Your topic here>	16:47
* jlaska resets fuse at 1 minute		16:48
jlaska	meeting ends in 30 seconds ...	16:49
* adamw will drive next week if no-one else wants to		16:49
jlaska	alright ... thanks for your time everyone	16:49
jlaska	let's call end of meeting	16:49
jlaska	I'll send a recap to the list	16:49
jlaska	#endmeeting	16:49

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