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<pre>
= Attendees =
# Fedora Quality Assurance Meeting
# Date: 2011-07-18
# Time: 15:00 UTC (https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Infrastructure/UTCHowto)
# Location: #fedora-meeting on irc.freenode.net


Greetings testers!
People present (lines said):
* jlaska (116)
* athmane (23)
* j_dulaney (16)
* robatino (13)
* adamw (12)
* rbergeron (12)
* tflink (5)
* brunowolff (5)
* zodbot (5)
* jforbes (4)
* jskladan (2)
* kparal (2)
* vhumpa (1)
* mkrizek (1)
* Viking-Ice (1)
* jsmith (1)
* pschindl (1)


This is a reminder of the upcoming QA meeting tomorrow.  Please add any topic suggestions to meeting wiki page at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/QA/Meetings/20110717.
Unable to attend:
# [[User:Rhe|Rhe]] (hopefully sleeping)
# [[User:Hongqing|Hongqing]] (hopefully sleeping)
# [[User:wutao85|wutao85]] (hopefully sleeping)


A proposed meeting agenda is included below. Please respond to this email, or update the meeting wiki page with suggested topics. If no additional topics are suggested, the meeting will be canceled.
= Agenda =
</pre>
* [http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/test/2011-July/101355.html Proposed meeting agenda]
* [http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2011-07-18/fedora-qa.2011-07-18-15.00.html MeetBot summary]


== Proposed Agenda Topics ==
== Previous meeting follow-up ==
=== Previous meeting follow-up ===
# j_dulaney will check-in with desktop team for guidance on s-c-* -- thank you j_dulaney!!! (jlaska, 15:04:33)
# j_dulaney will check-in with desktop team for guidance on s-c-* -- thank you j_dulaney!!!
#* LINK:    http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/desktop/2011-July/007342.html
#* ACTION: j_dulaney volunteered to file bugs against s-c-* packages to recommend patching their .desktop file to avoid application name collisions (NotShowIn=...)
# jlaska will announce F16 Alpha blocker review meeting on Wednesday
# jlaska will announce F16 Alpha blocker review meeting on Wednesday
#* ACTION: jlaska - announce F16-Alpha-Blocker meeting #2
# rbergeron will reach out to cloud-sig for a last call on test case ideas
# rbergeron will reach out to cloud-sig for a last call on test case ideas
# athmane volunteered to update update release validation SOP to include new Security SPIN test matrix  
#* LINK: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Day:2011-07-19_Cloud_SIG_Fedora_EC2
#* athmane volunteered to update update release validation SOP to include new Security SPIN test matrix
#* LINK: http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/test/2011-July/101284.html


=== Open Discussion - <your topic here> ===
== Cloud SIG - Fedora 15 on Amazon EC2 ==
# Fedora 15 on Amazon EC2 test day is scheduled this TUESDAY (2011-07-19)
# Athmane has copied the draft page and categorized it: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Day:2011-07-19_Cloud_SIG_Fedora_EC2
# TODO: Athmane is waiting for Fedora 15 AMI ID to update the wiki page.
# Cloud SIG Meeting Minutes - 2011-07-15: http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/cloud/2011-July/000670.html
# F15 AMI's not yet available, will propose rescheduling test day with Cloud Sig.  Stay tuned to cloud@lists.fedoraproject.org
 
== Next meeting ==
* Monday @ 15:00 UTC, July 25 2011
* jlaska will #chair the meeting next week
 
= Open Discussion - <your topic here> =
 
== Minimum Delta-ISO size ==
* robatino asked .. ."if anyone had any ideas about why the minimum deltaiso size increased in F15"
* LINK: http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/test/2011-May/100322.html
* if you run makedeltaiso on 2 successive F14 netinsts, it would be about a factor of 2 or 3 smaller, but not in F15
* robatino will discuss with jdieter to help further isolate the problem.
 
== oVirt Node Fedora 16 Spin ==
* LINK:  http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/test/2011-July/101362.html
* There is a link of "applications"/ tests on the SPIN wiki at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ovirt_Node_Spin#Scope_.2F_Testing
* Athmane + jlaska will continue discussing options post-meeting
 
= Action Items =
* j_dulaney volunteered to file bugs against s-c-* packages to recommend patching their .desktop file to avoid application name collisions (NotShowIn=...)
* jlaska - announce F16-Alpha-Blocker meeting #2
 
= IRC Log =
 
{|
|- id="t15:00:43"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #startmeeting Fedora QA meeting
|| [[#t15:00:43|15:00]]
|- id="t15:00:43"
! style="background-color: #42427e" | zodbot
| style="color: #42427e" | Meeting started Mon Jul 18 15:00:43 2011 UTC.  The chair is jlaska. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
|| [[#t15:00:43|15:00]]
|- id="t15:00:43"
! style="background-color: #42427e" | zodbot
| style="color: #42427e" | Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
|| [[#t15:00:43|15:00]]
|- id="t15:00:46"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #meetingname fedora-qa
|| [[#t15:00:46|15:00]]
|- id="t15:00:46"
! style="background-color: #42427e" | zodbot
| style="color: #42427e" | The meeting name has been set to 'fedora-qa'
|| [[#t15:00:46|15:00]]
|- id="t15:00:49"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #topic Roll Call
|| [[#t15:00:49|15:00]]
|- id="t15:00:56"
| colspan="2" | * mkrizek here
|| [[#t15:00:56|15:00]]
|- id="t15:01:03"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | Hi mkrizek
|| [[#t15:01:03|15:01]]
|- id="t15:01:04"
| colspan="2" | * tflink present
|| [[#t15:01:04|15:01]]
|- id="t15:01:06"
| colspan="2" | * athmane here
|| [[#t15:01:06|15:01]]
|- id="t15:01:15"
| colspan="2" | * robatino here
|| [[#t15:01:15|15:01]]
|- id="t15:01:20"
| colspan="2" | * jlaska tips hat to tflink, athmane and robatino
|| [[#t15:01:20|15:01]]
|- id="t15:01:45"
| colspan="2" | * kparal joined
|| [[#t15:01:45|15:01]]
|- id="t15:02:02"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | ahoj kparal!
|| [[#t15:02:02|15:02]]
|- id="t15:02:12"
| colspan="2" | * jskladan lurks
|| [[#t15:02:12|15:02]]
|- id="t15:02:16"
| colspan="2" | * j_dulaney waves
|| [[#t15:02:16|15:02]]
|- id="t15:02:20"
! style="background-color: #818144" | kparal
| style="color: #818144" | ahoj vespolek :)
|| [[#t15:02:20|15:02]]
|- id="t15:02:24"
| colspan="2" | * pschindl is here
|| [[#t15:02:24|15:02]]
|- id="t15:02:25"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | hello j.* :)
|| [[#t15:02:25|15:02]]
|- id="t15:02:34"
| colspan="2" | * jsmith lurks
|| [[#t15:02:34|15:02]]
|- id="t15:02:53"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | zodbot needs a .translate feature :)
|| [[#t15:02:53|15:02]]
|- id="t15:03:09"
! style="background-color: #854685" | jskladan
| style="color: #854685" | :)
|| [[#t15:03:09|15:03]]
|- id="t15:03:18"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | alright ... anyone we're missing
|| [[#t15:03:18|15:03]]
|- id="t15:03:27"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | Viking-Ice, adamw, me?
|| [[#t15:03:27|15:03]]
|- id="t15:03:45"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | let's get started, and hopefully they'll join in if needed+available
|| [[#t15:03:45|15:03]]
|- id="t15:04:06"
| colspan="2" | * j_dulaney notes that some little boy knocks over a chair and immediately states that it wasn't his fault is a commentary on the sad state of responsibility
|| [[#t15:04:06|15:04]]
|- id="t15:04:12"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | thanks to athmane for the topic ... so far only two planned agenda items, so this _might_ be quick
|| [[#t15:04:12|15:04]]
|- id="t15:04:19"
| colspan="2" | * Viking-Ice sneaks in..
|| [[#t15:04:19|15:04]]
|- id="t15:04:25"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #topic Previous meeting follow-up
|| [[#t15:04:25|15:04]]
|- id="t15:04:33"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #info j_dulaney will check-in with desktop team for guidance on s-c-* -- thank you j_dulaney!!!
|| [[#t15:04:33|15:04]]
|- id="t15:04:50"
! style="background-color: #488888" | j_dulaney
| style="color: #488888" | Yo
|| [[#t15:04:50|15:04]]
|- id="t15:04:51"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | I haven't checked in on desktop@ yet ... not sure if there was any movement on the s-c-* front
|| [[#t15:04:51|15:04]]
|- id="t15:05:20"
! style="background-color: #488888" | j_dulaney
| style="color: #488888" | Their response was that it isn't their area
|| [[#t15:05:20|15:05]]
|- id="t15:05:21"
! style="background-color: #8c4a4a" | adamw
| style="color: #8c4a4a" | yo
|| [[#t15:05:21|15:05]]
|- id="t15:05:25"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | looks like bastien notes they aren't owned by desktop@ and wondered if bugs have been filed yet?
|| [[#t15:05:25|15:05]]
|- id="t15:05:38"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #link http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/desktop/2011-July/007342.html
|| [[#t15:05:38|15:05]]
|- id="t15:05:42"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | adamw: heyo
|| [[#t15:05:42|15:05]]
|- id="t15:05:52"
| colspan="2" | * brunowolff is here, but was in another window and time slipped by.
|| [[#t15:05:52|15:05]]
|- id="t15:06:15"
! style="background-color: #8c4a4a" | adamw
| style="color: #8c4a4a" | jlaska: yeah, that's right.
|| [[#t15:06:15|15:06]]
|- id="t15:06:18"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | welcome brunowolff, no worries
|| [[#t15:06:18|15:06]]
|- id="t15:06:30"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | so what's next then ... file bugs for each of these with a recommended change?
|| [[#t15:06:30|15:06]]
|- id="t15:06:40"
! style="background-color: #8c4a4a" | adamw
| style="color: #8c4a4a" | sure
|| [[#t15:06:40|15:06]]
|- id="t15:07:11"
| colspan="2" | * j_dulaney shall take care of that
|| [[#t15:07:11|15:07]]
|- id="t15:07:45"
! style="background-color: #8c4a4a" | adamw
| style="color: #8c4a4a" | yay
|| [[#t15:07:45|15:07]]
|- id="t15:07:48"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | and the recommended fix for each of those is to include a patched .desktop file that has "NotInDesktop=..." ?
|| [[#t15:07:48|15:07]]
|- id="t15:07:53"
| colspan="2" | * jlaska forgets the exact syntax
|| [[#t15:07:53|15:07]]
|- id="t15:08:00"
! style="background-color: #8c4a4a" | adamw
| style="color: #8c4a4a" | basically, yeah.
|| [[#t15:08:00|15:08]]
|- id="t15:08:04"
! style="background-color: #8c4a4a" | adamw
| style="color: #8c4a4a" | NotShowIn, I think.
|| [[#t15:08:04|15:08]]
|- id="t15:08:06"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | thx
|| [[#t15:08:06|15:08]]
|- id="t15:08:25"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | do we expect these bz's to be well received ... or will the WTF flags be flying high after filing these?
|| [[#t15:08:25|15:08]]
|- id="t15:08:40"
! style="background-color: #488888" | j_dulaney
| style="color: #488888" | Who knows?
|| [[#t15:08:40|15:08]]
|- id="t15:08:51"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | one way to find out, right! :D
|| [[#t15:08:51|15:08]]
|- id="t15:09:24"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | j_dulaney: thanks for volunteering, please do shout if you want some help filing or pulling together info for the bugs
|| [[#t15:09:24|15:09]]
|- id="t15:09:25"
! style="background-color: #4b904b" | brunowolff
| style="color: #4b904b" | A note about why the request is being made in the bug reports will probably help there.
|| [[#t15:09:25|15:09]]
|- id="t15:09:33"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | good point
|| [[#t15:09:33|15:09]]
|- id="t15:09:33"
! style="background-color: #8c4a4a" | adamw
| style="color: #8c4a4a" | i doubt there'd be much of a problem
|| [[#t15:09:33|15:09]]
|- id="t15:09:59"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | are we filing against all s-c-* packages, or only a subset at first?
|| [[#t15:09:59|15:09]]
|- id="t15:10:00"
! style="background-color: #488888" | j_dulaney
| style="color: #488888" | Indeed
|| [[#t15:10:00|15:10]]
|- id="t15:10:43"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #action j_dulaney volunteered to file bugs against s-c-* packages to recommend patching their .desktop file to avoid application name collisions (NotShowIn=...)
|| [[#t15:10:43|15:10]]
|- id="t15:10:52"
! style="background-color: #488888" | j_dulaney
| style="color: #488888" | Maybe all, with a blocker bug?
|| [[#t15:10:52|15:10]]
|- id="t15:11:02"
! style="background-color: #8c4a4a" | adamw
| style="color: #8c4a4a" | only the ones there are equivalents for
|| [[#t15:11:02|15:11]]
|- id="t15:11:19"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | yeah, the smaller target where we have known naming collisions seems good
|| [[#t15:11:19|15:11]]
|- id="t15:11:20"
! style="background-color: #488888" | j_dulaney
| style="color: #488888" | Indeed
|| [[#t15:11:20|15:11]]
|- id="t15:11:31"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | are those previously listed somewhere for j_dulaney?
|| [[#t15:11:31|15:11]]
|- id="t15:11:38"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | s-c-keyboard, s-c-date ... ?
|| [[#t15:11:38|15:11]]
|- id="t15:11:55"
! style="background-color: #488888" | j_dulaney
| style="color: #488888" | Indeed, I have 'em
|| [[#t15:11:55|15:11]]
|- id="t15:11:58"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | okay, great
|| [[#t15:11:58|15:11]]
|- id="t15:12:01"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | thanks j_dulaney!
|| [[#t15:12:01|15:12]]
|- id="t15:12:06"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #info jlaska will announce F16 Alpha blocker review meeting on Wednesday
|| [[#t15:12:06|15:12]]
|- id="t15:12:25"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | this was a really *small* task, but more a reminder that I needed to start sending those out again
|| [[#t15:12:25|15:12]]
|- id="t15:12:35"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | I'll do it again on Wednesday, unless someone is anxious for the task
|| [[#t15:12:35|15:12]]
|- id="t15:12:51"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #action jlaska - announce F16-Alpha-Blocker meeting #2
|| [[#t15:12:51|15:12]]
|- id="t15:12:55"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #info rbergeron will reach out to cloud-sig for a last call on test case ideas
|| [[#t15:12:55|15:12]]
|- id="t15:13:15"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | athmane and tflink, you two have been tracking this ... do you know where this stands?
|| [[#t15:13:15|15:13]]
|- id="t15:13:33"
| colspan="2" | * athmane is waiting for ami ids
|| [[#t15:13:33|15:13]]
|- id="t15:13:39"
! style="background-color: #4d4d93" | tflink
| style="color: #4d4d93" | same here
|| [[#t15:13:39|15:13]]
|- id="t15:13:40"
! style="background-color: #97974f" | athmane
| style="color: #97974f" | test cases are ok
|| [[#t15:13:40|15:13]]
|- id="t15:13:49"
! style="background-color: #97974f" | athmane
| style="color: #97974f" | #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Day:2011-07-19_Cloud_SIG_Fedora_EC2
|| [[#t15:13:49|15:13]]
|- id="t15:14:00"
! style="background-color: #4d4d93" | tflink
| style="color: #4d4d93" | planning to send out an announcement later today
|| [[#t15:14:00|15:14]]
|- id="t15:14:15"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | oh, this is really related to the test day topic then?
|| [[#t15:14:15|15:14]]
|- id="t15:14:30"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | I'll move on and we can discuss that in more detail shortly ...
|| [[#t15:14:30|15:14]]
|- id="t15:14:37"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #info athmane volunteered to update update release validation SOP to include new Security SPIN test matrix
|| [[#t15:14:37|15:14]]
|- id="t15:14:39"
! style="background-color: #97974f" | athmane
| style="color: #97974f" | yes
|| [[#t15:14:39|15:14]]
|- id="t15:14:54"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | athmane: thank you for updating the wiki's ... and adamw for announcing the changes
|| [[#t15:14:54|15:14]]
|- id="t15:14:57"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #link http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/test/2011-July/101284.html
|| [[#t15:14:57|15:14]]
|- id="t15:14:59"
! style="background-color: #97974f" | athmane
| style="color: #97974f" | me and adamw updated SOP
|| [[#t15:14:59|15:14]]
|- id="t15:15:00"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | I think we can close that out
|| [[#t15:15:00|15:15]]
|- id="t15:15:09"
| colspan="2" | * vhumpa is awfully late for his portion of lurking
|| [[#t15:15:09|15:15]]
|- id="t15:15:15"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | vhumpa: welcome lurker! :D
|| [[#t15:15:15|15:15]]
|- id="t15:15:21"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | okay, on to athmane's topic
|| [[#t15:15:21|15:15]]
|- id="t15:15:23"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #topic Cloud SIG - Fedora 15 on Amazon EC2
|| [[#t15:15:23|15:15]]
|- id="t15:15:33"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #chair athmane
|| [[#t15:15:33|15:15]]
|- id="t15:15:33"
! style="background-color: #42427e" | zodbot
| style="color: #42427e" | Current chairs: athmane jlaska
|| [[#t15:15:33|15:15]]
|- id="t15:15:55"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | athmane: feel free to take it away ... otherwise I'll just meetbot the commands you included in the agenda
|| [[#t15:15:55|15:15]]
|- id="t15:16:22"
! style="background-color: #97974f" | athmane
| style="color: #97974f" | ok
|| [[#t15:16:22|15:16]]
|- id="t15:16:46"
! style="background-color: #97974f" | athmane
| style="color: #97974f" | in the last cloud sig we agreed that tomorrow will be the test day
|| [[#t15:16:46|15:16]]
|- id="t15:17:06"
! style="background-color: #97974f" | athmane
| style="color: #97974f" | but we don't yet have f15 ami ids
|| [[#t15:17:06|15:17]]
|- id="t15:17:20"
! style="background-color: #97974f" | athmane
| style="color: #97974f" | #link http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/cloud/2011-July/000670.html
|| [[#t15:17:20|15:17]]
|- id="t15:17:40"
! style="background-color: #97974f" | athmane
| style="color: #97974f" | #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Day:2011-07-19_Cloud_SIG_Fedora_EC2
|| [[#t15:17:40|15:17]]
|- id="t15:17:52"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | To state the obvious, I assume the event cannot proceed until AMI's are available for testing?
|| [[#t15:17:52|15:17]]
|- id="t15:18:04"
! style="background-color: #97974f" | athmane
| style="color: #97974f" | yes
|| [[#t15:18:04|15:18]]
|- id="t15:18:05"
! style="background-color: #9b519b" | rbergeron
| style="color: #9b519b" | We have some AMI ID's.
|| [[#t15:18:05|15:18]]
|- id="t15:18:20"
! style="background-color: #9b519b" | rbergeron
| style="color: #9b519b" | They're just not the ones that were recently recently made
|| [[#t15:18:20|15:18]]
|- id="t15:18:22"
! style="background-color: #97974f" | athmane
| style="color: #97974f" | I meant the newer ami ids
|| [[#t15:18:22|15:18]]
|- id="t15:18:26"
! style="background-color: #9b519b" | rbergeron
| style="color: #9b519b" | yeah.
|| [[#t15:18:26|15:18]]
|- id="t15:18:28"
! style="background-color: #4d4d93" | tflink
| style="color: #4d4d93" | the AMIs are up, but I believe that they were going to be tested before the numbers were sent out
|| [[#t15:18:28|15:18]]
|- id="t15:18:28"
! style="background-color: #9b519b" | rbergeron
| style="color: #9b519b" | jforbes: ringring
|| [[#t15:18:28|15:18]]
|- id="t15:19:21"
| colspan="2" | * rbergeron is working on it. I'll pop back in before end of meeting and report progress
|| [[#t15:19:21|15:19]]
|- id="t15:19:42"
| colspan="2" | * jforbes is looking
|| [[#t15:19:42|15:19]]
|- id="t15:19:58"
! style="background-color: #8c4a4a" | adamw
| style="color: #8c4a4a" | should we delay the event now even if the amis turn up today?
|| [[#t15:19:58|15:19]]
|- id="t15:20:05"
! style="background-color: #8c4a4a" | adamw
| style="color: #8c4a4a" | one day isn't too long to get much publicity done
|| [[#t15:20:05|15:20]]
|- id="t15:20:24"
! style="background-color: #97974f" | athmane
| style="color: #97974f" | +1
|| [[#t15:20:24|15:20]]
|- id="t15:20:36"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | move to Thu?
|| [[#t15:20:36|15:20]]
|- id="t15:20:38"
! style="background-color: #488888" | j_dulaney
| style="color: #488888" | +1 on delay
|| [[#t15:20:38|15:20]]
|- id="t15:20:39"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | or push out 1 week
|| [[#t15:20:39|15:20]]
|- id="t15:20:48"
! style="background-color: #9b519b" | rbergeron
| style="color: #9b519b" | it's up to you guys - it depends on what you think is best, i can't run a test day. :)
|| [[#t15:20:48|15:20]]
|- id="t15:20:57"
! style="background-color: #9b519b" | rbergeron
| style="color: #9b519b" | (well, i could, but you know, disaster and all)
|| [[#t15:20:57|15:20]]
|- id="t15:20:59"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | plenty of breathing room remains in https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/QA/Fedora_16_test_days
|| [[#t15:20:59|15:20]]
|- id="t15:20:59"
! style="background-color: #488888" | j_dulaney
| style="color: #488888" | As an aside, it looks like I just booted F16
|| [[#t15:20:59|15:20]]
|- id="t15:21:20"
! style="background-color: #488888" | j_dulaney
| style="color: #488888" | Push out a week?
|| [[#t15:21:20|15:21]]
|- id="t15:21:21"
! style="background-color: #539e9e" | jforbes
| style="color: #539e9e" | Yeah, certainly need to deltay
|| [[#t15:21:21|15:21]]
|- id="t15:21:22"
! style="background-color: #9b519b" | rbergeron
| style="color: #9b519b" | jlaska: yeah, the key here is that it's fedora 15, so we're already kind of like way behind.
|| [[#t15:21:22|15:21]]
|- id="t15:21:23"
! style="background-color: #488888" | j_dulaney
| style="color: #488888" | I'm for that
|| [[#t15:21:23|15:21]]
|- id="t15:21:29"
! style="background-color: #97974f" | athmane
| style="color: #97974f" | jlaska: it's for f15 not f16
|| [[#t15:21:29|15:21]]
|- id="t15:21:40"
! style="background-color: #539e9e" | jforbes
| style="color: #539e9e" | I am looking right now, rel-eng has not uploaded any new images
|| [[#t15:21:40|15:21]]
|- id="t15:21:59"
! style="background-color: #9b519b" | rbergeron
| style="color: #9b519b" | okay.
|| [[#t15:21:59|15:21]]
|- id="t15:22:16"
! style="background-color: #9b519b" | rbergeron
| style="color: #9b519b" | jforbes: let's sort it out and we'll circle back with athmane and tflink to reschedule
|| [[#t15:22:16|15:22]]
|- id="t15:22:29"
| colspan="2" | * athmane wonders who'll be available during f15 on ec2 test day
|| [[#t15:22:29|15:22]]
|- id="t15:22:30"
| colspan="2" | * rbergeron salutes the QA team for their patience with us and for all their help
|| [[#t15:22:30|15:22]]
|- id="t15:22:56"
| colspan="2" | * jforbes will be available, whenever it ends up
|| [[#t15:22:56|15:22]]
|- id="t15:23:05"
! style="background-color: #488888" | j_dulaney
| style="color: #488888" | athmane:  I will be
|| [[#t15:23:05|15:23]]
|- id="t15:23:34"
! style="background-color: #488888" | j_dulaney
| style="color: #488888" | Well, so much for F16 logging in.  It booted, though, which is better than my last try
|| [[#t15:23:34|15:23]]
|- id="t15:23:36"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | athmane: it is ... but that's the test day schedule we need to be looking at for now
|| [[#t15:23:36|15:23]]
|- id="t15:23:40"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | to avoid conflicts
|| [[#t15:23:40|15:23]]
|- id="t15:24:39"
! style="background-color: #4d4d93" | tflink
| style="color: #4d4d93" | I was hoping to get it done before the F16 test days started
|| [[#t15:24:39|15:24]]
|- id="t15:24:39"
| colspan="2" | * rbergeron nods
|| [[#t15:24:39|15:24]]
|- id="t15:24:51"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | yeah, that's a good plan
|| [[#t15:24:51|15:24]]
|- id="t15:25:22"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | athmane: any particular date in mind for rescheduling, or will that be discussed after meeting?
|| [[#t15:25:22|15:25]]
|- id="t15:25:48"
! style="background-color: #97974f" | athmane
| style="color: #97974f" | jlaska: it's up to cloud sig
|| [[#t15:25:48|15:25]]
|- id="t15:25:51"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | okay
|| [[#t15:25:51|15:25]]
|- id="t15:26:36"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #info F15 AMI's not yet available, will propose rescheduling test day with Cloud Sig.  Stay tuned to cloud@lists.fedoraproject.org
|| [[#t15:26:36|15:26]]
|- id="t15:26:52"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | athmane: anything else you want to highlight on this topic?
|| [[#t15:26:52|15:26]]
|- id="t15:27:07"
! style="background-color: #97974f" | athmane
| style="color: #97974f" | no
|| [[#t15:27:07|15:27]]
|- id="t15:27:38"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | athmane: okay, thanks for raising this #topic
|| [[#t15:27:38|15:27]]
|- id="t15:27:50"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | folks can follow the action on cloud@ after the meeting :)
|| [[#t15:27:50|15:27]]
|- id="t15:27:56"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #topic Open Discussion - &lt;your topic here&gt;
|| [[#t15:27:56|15:27]]
|- id="t15:28:07"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | okay, I had nothing else on the agenda for today ... so it's open-mic time
|| [[#t15:28:07|15:28]]
|- id="t15:29:03"
! style="background-color: #a25555" | robatino
| style="color: #a25555" | i was wondering if anyone had any ideas about why the minimum deltaiso size increased in F15 - see http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/test/2011-May/100322.html
|| [[#t15:29:03|15:29]]
|- id="t15:29:09"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #chair robatino
|| [[#t15:29:09|15:29]]
|- id="t15:29:09"
! style="background-color: #42427e" | zodbot
| style="color: #42427e" | Current chairs: athmane jlaska robatino
|| [[#t15:29:09|15:29]]
|- id="t15:29:12"
! style="background-color: #4b904b" | brunowolff
| style="color: #4b904b" | I haven't heard any updates on the grub issue.
|| [[#t15:29:12|15:29]]
|- id="t15:29:16"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #topic Minimum Delta-ISO size
|| [[#t15:29:16|15:29]]
|- id="t15:29:25"
! style="background-color: #a25555" | robatino
| style="color: #a25555" | i'm pretty sure it has something to do with https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=646843
|| [[#t15:29:25|15:29]]
|- id="t15:29:31"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #info robatino asked .. ."if anyone had any ideas about why the minimum deltaiso size increased in F15"
|| [[#t15:29:31|15:29]]
|- id="t15:29:34"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #link http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/test/2011-May/100322.html
|| [[#t15:29:34|15:29]]
|- id="t15:29:40"
! style="background-color: #a25555" | robatino
| style="color: #a25555" | images/install.img will no longer exist in F-15 and newer
|| [[#t15:29:40|15:29]]
|- id="t15:29:49"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | brunowolff: that's my next TODO .. I'll nudge that issue after the meeting
|| [[#t15:29:49|15:29]]
|- id="t15:29:51"
! style="background-color: #4b904b" | brunowolff
| style="color: #4b904b" | The 32 bit SMP lockup issue is fixed in Linus' tree, but didn' make it into the kernels built over the weekend.
|| [[#t15:29:51|15:29]]
|- id="t15:30:20"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | robatino: are the images/install.img and the delta iso two different topics, or related?
|| [[#t15:30:20|15:30]]
|- id="t15:31:03"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | robatino: hmm, clumens or wwoods might know more regarding the compression of the delta images
|| [[#t15:31:03|15:31]]
|- id="t15:31:11"
! style="background-color: #a25555" | robatino
| style="color: #a25555" | jlaska: it turns out that it has something to do with different netinst images not delta-compressing any more, it must have something to do with the change in the install images
|| [[#t15:31:11|15:31]]
|- id="t15:31:18"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | your instincts could be correct, the install.img may not compress well, since it's already compressed
|| [[#t15:31:18|15:31]]
|- id="t15:31:37"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | but ...
|| [[#t15:31:37|15:31]]
|- id="t15:31:42"
! style="background-color: #a25555" | robatino
| style="color: #a25555" | not deltacompressing _well_, i mean - it used to compress by a factor of several, as of F15 it's negligible
|| [[#t15:31:42|15:31]]
|- id="t15:31:49"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | well ...
|| [[#t15:31:49|15:31]]
|- id="t15:31:57"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | the content really hasn't changed much between F15 and previous
|| [[#t15:31:57|15:31]]
|- id="t15:32:08"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | it's just moved from images/install.img into the images/pxeboot/initrd.img
|| [[#t15:32:08|15:32]]
|- id="t15:32:21"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | so maybe something about the initial ramdisk naturally doesn't lend well to re-compression or something?
|| [[#t15:32:21|15:32]]
|- id="t15:32:24"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | &lt;/wag&gt;
|| [[#t15:32:24|15:32]]
|- id="t15:32:37"
! style="background-color: #a25555" | robatino
| style="color: #a25555" | for example if you run makedeltaiso on 2 successive F14 netinsts, it would be about a factor of 2 or 3 smaller, but not in F15
|| [[#t15:32:37|15:32]]
|- id="t15:32:59"
! style="background-color: #a25555" | robatino
| style="color: #a25555" | quantified in http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/test/2011-May/100449.html
|| [[#t15:32:59|15:32]]
|- id="t15:33:18"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #info if you run makedeltaiso on 2 successive F14 netinsts, it would be about a factor of 2 or 3 smaller, but not in F15
|| [[#t15:33:18|15:33]]
|- id="t15:33:21"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | nice data
|| [[#t15:33:21|15:33]]
|- id="t15:33:27"
! style="background-color: #a25555" | robatino
| style="color: #a25555" | not that big a deal, was wondering if there was some trivial way to fix it
|| [[#t15:33:27|15:33]]
|- id="t15:33:43"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | I'm just not very experienced with delta-iso ... we can definitely hit up clumens to work through your thoughts on the install.img if you like
|| [[#t15:33:43|15:33]]
|- id="t15:33:56"
! style="background-color: #a25555" | robatino
| style="color: #a25555" | would be nice to get back to a minimum size of 60-70 M instead of about 200 M now
|| [[#t15:33:56|15:33]]
|- id="t15:34:02"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | yeah
|| [[#t15:34:02|15:34]]
|- id="t15:34:09"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | otherwise, defeats the purposed I would think
|| [[#t15:34:09|15:34]]
|- id="t15:34:19"
| colspan="2" | * adamw thought robatino was the expert on deltaiso
|| [[#t15:34:19|15:34]]
|- id="t15:34:27"
! style="background-color: #8c4a4a" | adamw
| style="color: #8c4a4a" | no point _you_ asking _us_ for help :P
|| [[#t15:34:27|15:34]]
|- id="t15:34:27"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | he is!
|| [[#t15:34:27|15:34]]
|- id="t15:34:42"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | I believe robatino is known in some circles as, "Mr. Delta ISO"
|| [[#t15:34:42|15:34]]
|- id="t15:34:46"
! style="background-color: #a25555" | robatino
| style="color: #a25555" | no, i don't really know the internals, jdieter is the expert
|| [[#t15:34:46|15:34]]
|- id="t15:34:59"
! style="background-color: #a25555" | robatino
| style="color: #a25555" | it's just very easy to use which is why i can do it
|| [[#t15:34:59|15:34]]
|- id="t15:35:01"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | did he have any thoughts on this?
|| [[#t15:35:01|15:35]]
|- id="t15:35:18"
! style="background-color: #a25555" | robatino
| style="color: #a25555" | haven't asked yet, he's been away, i could email anyway
|| [[#t15:35:18|15:35]]
|- id="t15:35:19"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | s/ [s]he /
|| [[#t15:35:19|15:35]]
|- id="t15:35:23"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | okay
|| [[#t15:35:23|15:35]]
|- id="t15:35:37"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | well, lemme know if I can help chase down the install.img angle with you
|| [[#t15:35:37|15:35]]
|- id="t15:35:48"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | otherwise, we'll stay tuned :)
|| [[#t15:35:48|15:35]]
|- id="t15:35:53"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #topic Open Discussion - &lt;your topic here&gt;
|| [[#t15:35:53|15:35]]
|- id="t15:36:15"
! style="background-color: #4b904b" | brunowolff
| style="color: #4b904b" | Deltaiso might need to get special knowledge of the initrd so it can uncompress another level deep before doing comparisons.
|| [[#t15:36:15|15:36]]
|- id="t15:36:43"
! style="background-color: #97974f" | athmane
| style="color: #97974f" | ovirt spin
|| [[#t15:36:43|15:36]]
|- id="t15:36:53"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #topic oVirt Node Fedora 16 Spin
|| [[#t15:36:53|15:36]]
|- id="t15:36:59"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #link http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/test/2011-July/101362.html
|| [[#t15:36:59|15:36]]
|- id="t15:37:02"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | athmane: thanks :)
|| [[#t15:37:02|15:37]]
|- id="t15:37:16"
! style="background-color: #97974f" | athmane
| style="color: #97974f" | I can help with that
|| [[#t15:37:16|15:37]]
|- id="t15:37:34"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | so, I'm providing guidance to Joey so that they follow a similar model that athmane setup ... that seems like the best approach to me, and works with our existing process
|| [[#t15:37:34|15:37]]
|- id="t15:37:35"
! style="background-color: #97974f" | athmane
| style="color: #97974f" | I asked for kickstart and applications list
|| [[#t15:37:35|15:37]]
|- id="t15:37:59"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #info There is a link of "applications"/ tests on the SPIN wiki at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ovirt_Node_Spin#Scope_.2F_Testing
|| [[#t15:37:59|15:37]]
|- id="t15:38:11"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | I don't know if that's explicitly the info you are looking for
|| [[#t15:38:11|15:38]]
|- id="t15:38:43"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | imo, this seems to fit well with the matrix model we've been using so far ... so unless any other ideas surface, I'll likely keep messaging that route
|| [[#t15:38:43|15:38]]
|- id="t15:39:03"
! style="background-color: #97974f" | athmane
| style="color: #97974f" | well I'll look after the meeting
|| [[#t15:39:03|15:39]]
|- id="t15:39:26"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | athmane: maybe copy the security SPIN matrix you created with some stubs for the oVirt needs to provide some visualization of what we're talking about?
|| [[#t15:39:26|15:39]]
|- id="t15:39:29"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | athmane: okay
|| [[#t15:39:29|15:39]]
|- id="t15:39:48"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #info Athmane + jlaska will continue discussing options post-meeting
|| [[#t15:39:48|15:39]]
|- id="t15:39:54"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #topic Open Discussion - &lt;your topic here&gt;
|| [[#t15:39:54|15:39]]
|- id="t15:39:59"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | okay ... last call for topics
|| [[#t15:39:59|15:39]]
|- id="t15:40:46"
! style="background-color: #97974f" | athmane
| style="color: #97974f" | is it approved by rel-eng
|| [[#t15:40:46|15:40]]
|- id="t15:42:18"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | okay ... if nothing else ... we'll #endmeeting in 2 minutes
|| [[#t15:42:18|15:42]]
|- id="t15:43:20"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | will #endmeeting in 1 minute ...
|| [[#t15:43:20|15:43]]
|- id="t15:44:08"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | Well ... before ending, I could touch on the last topic ...
|| [[#t15:44:08|15:44]]
|- id="t15:44:12"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #topic Next meeting ...
|| [[#t15:44:12|15:44]]
|- id="t15:44:24"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #info Monday @ 15:00 UTC, July 25 2011
|| [[#t15:44:24|15:44]]
|- id="t15:44:37"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | Is anyone interested in #chairing the meeting?
|| [[#t15:44:37|15:44]]
|- id="t15:44:57"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | If not ... you're stuck with me continuing to nag for topics :)
|| [[#t15:44:57|15:44]]
|- id="t15:45:08"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #info jlaska will #chair the meeting next week
|| [[#t15:45:08|15:45]]
|- id="t15:45:12"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | alrighty ...thanks everything
|| [[#t15:45:12|15:45]]
|- id="t15:45:17"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | *and everyone :)
|| [[#t15:45:17|15:45]]
|- id="t15:45:22"
! style="background-color: #407a40" | jlaska
| style="color: #407a40" | #endmeeting
|| [[#t15:45:22|15:45]]
|}
 
Generated by irclog2html.py 2.7 by [mailto:marius@pov.lt Marius Gedminas] - find it at [http://mg.pov.lt/irclog2html mg.pov.lt]!

Latest revision as of 16:00, 18 July 2011

Attendees

People present (lines said):

  • jlaska (116)
  • athmane (23)
  • j_dulaney (16)
  • robatino (13)
  • adamw (12)
  • rbergeron (12)
  • tflink (5)
  • brunowolff (5)
  • zodbot (5)
  • jforbes (4)
  • jskladan (2)
  • kparal (2)
  • vhumpa (1)
  • mkrizek (1)
  • Viking-Ice (1)
  • jsmith (1)
  • pschindl (1)

Unable to attend:

  1. Rhe (hopefully sleeping)
  2. Hongqing (hopefully sleeping)
  3. wutao85 (hopefully sleeping)

Agenda

Previous meeting follow-up

  1. j_dulaney will check-in with desktop team for guidance on s-c-* -- thank you j_dulaney!!! (jlaska, 15:04:33)
  2. jlaska will announce F16 Alpha blocker review meeting on Wednesday
    • ACTION: jlaska - announce F16-Alpha-Blocker meeting #2
  3. rbergeron will reach out to cloud-sig for a last call on test case ideas

Cloud SIG - Fedora 15 on Amazon EC2

  1. Fedora 15 on Amazon EC2 test day is scheduled this TUESDAY (2011-07-19)
  2. Athmane has copied the draft page and categorized it: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Day:2011-07-19_Cloud_SIG_Fedora_EC2
  3. TODO: Athmane is waiting for Fedora 15 AMI ID to update the wiki page.
  4. Cloud SIG Meeting Minutes - 2011-07-15: http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/cloud/2011-July/000670.html
  5. F15 AMI's not yet available, will propose rescheduling test day with Cloud Sig. Stay tuned to cloud@lists.fedoraproject.org

Next meeting

  • Monday @ 15:00 UTC, July 25 2011
  • jlaska will #chair the meeting next week

Open Discussion - <your topic here>

Minimum Delta-ISO size

  • robatino asked .. ."if anyone had any ideas about why the minimum deltaiso size increased in F15"
  • LINK: http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/test/2011-May/100322.html
  • if you run makedeltaiso on 2 successive F14 netinsts, it would be about a factor of 2 or 3 smaller, but not in F15
  • robatino will discuss with jdieter to help further isolate the problem.

oVirt Node Fedora 16 Spin

Action Items

  • j_dulaney volunteered to file bugs against s-c-* packages to recommend patching their .desktop file to avoid application name collisions (NotShowIn=...)
  • jlaska - announce F16-Alpha-Blocker meeting #2

IRC Log

jlaska #startmeeting Fedora QA meeting 15:00
zodbot Meeting started Mon Jul 18 15:00:43 2011 UTC. The chair is jlaska. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 15:00
zodbot Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. 15:00
jlaska #meetingname fedora-qa 15:00
zodbot The meeting name has been set to 'fedora-qa' 15:00
jlaska #topic Roll Call 15:00
* mkrizek here 15:00
jlaska Hi mkrizek 15:01
* tflink present 15:01
* athmane here 15:01
* robatino here 15:01
* jlaska tips hat to tflink, athmane and robatino 15:01
* kparal joined 15:01
jlaska ahoj kparal! 15:02
* jskladan lurks 15:02
* j_dulaney waves 15:02
kparal ahoj vespolek :) 15:02
* pschindl is here 15:02
jlaska hello j.* :) 15:02
* jsmith lurks 15:02
jlaska zodbot needs a .translate feature :) 15:02
jskladan :) 15:03
jlaska alright ... anyone we're missing 15:03
jlaska Viking-Ice, adamw, me? 15:03
jlaska let's get started, and hopefully they'll join in if needed+available 15:03
* j_dulaney notes that some little boy knocks over a chair and immediately states that it wasn't his fault is a commentary on the sad state of responsibility 15:04
jlaska thanks to athmane for the topic ... so far only two planned agenda items, so this _might_ be quick 15:04
* Viking-Ice sneaks in.. 15:04
jlaska #topic Previous meeting follow-up 15:04
jlaska #info j_dulaney will check-in with desktop team for guidance on s-c-* -- thank you j_dulaney!!! 15:04
j_dulaney Yo 15:04
jlaska I haven't checked in on desktop@ yet ... not sure if there was any movement on the s-c-* front 15:04
j_dulaney Their response was that it isn't their area 15:05
adamw yo 15:05
jlaska looks like bastien notes they aren't owned by desktop@ and wondered if bugs have been filed yet? 15:05
jlaska #link http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/desktop/2011-July/007342.html 15:05
jlaska adamw: heyo 15:05
* brunowolff is here, but was in another window and time slipped by. 15:05
adamw jlaska: yeah, that's right. 15:06
jlaska welcome brunowolff, no worries 15:06
jlaska so what's next then ... file bugs for each of these with a recommended change? 15:06
adamw sure 15:06
* j_dulaney shall take care of that 15:07
adamw yay 15:07
jlaska and the recommended fix for each of those is to include a patched .desktop file that has "NotInDesktop=..." ? 15:07
* jlaska forgets the exact syntax 15:07
adamw basically, yeah. 15:08
adamw NotShowIn, I think. 15:08
jlaska thx 15:08
jlaska do we expect these bz's to be well received ... or will the WTF flags be flying high after filing these? 15:08
j_dulaney Who knows? 15:08
jlaska one way to find out, right! :D 15:08
jlaska j_dulaney: thanks for volunteering, please do shout if you want some help filing or pulling together info for the bugs 15:09
brunowolff A note about why the request is being made in the bug reports will probably help there. 15:09
jlaska good point 15:09
adamw i doubt there'd be much of a problem 15:09
jlaska are we filing against all s-c-* packages, or only a subset at first? 15:09
j_dulaney Indeed 15:10
jlaska #action j_dulaney volunteered to file bugs against s-c-* packages to recommend patching their .desktop file to avoid application name collisions (NotShowIn=...) 15:10
j_dulaney Maybe all, with a blocker bug? 15:10
adamw only the ones there are equivalents for 15:11
jlaska yeah, the smaller target where we have known naming collisions seems good 15:11
j_dulaney Indeed 15:11
jlaska are those previously listed somewhere for j_dulaney? 15:11
jlaska s-c-keyboard, s-c-date ... ? 15:11
j_dulaney Indeed, I have 'em 15:11
jlaska okay, great 15:11
jlaska thanks j_dulaney! 15:12
jlaska #info jlaska will announce F16 Alpha blocker review meeting on Wednesday 15:12
jlaska this was a really *small* task, but more a reminder that I needed to start sending those out again 15:12
jlaska I'll do it again on Wednesday, unless someone is anxious for the task 15:12
jlaska #action jlaska - announce F16-Alpha-Blocker meeting #2 15:12
jlaska #info rbergeron will reach out to cloud-sig for a last call on test case ideas 15:12
jlaska athmane and tflink, you two have been tracking this ... do you know where this stands? 15:13
* athmane is waiting for ami ids 15:13
tflink same here 15:13
athmane test cases are ok 15:13
athmane #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Day:2011-07-19_Cloud_SIG_Fedora_EC2 15:13
tflink planning to send out an announcement later today 15:14
jlaska oh, this is really related to the test day topic then? 15:14
jlaska I'll move on and we can discuss that in more detail shortly ... 15:14
jlaska #info athmane volunteered to update update release validation SOP to include new Security SPIN test matrix 15:14
athmane yes 15:14
jlaska athmane: thank you for updating the wiki's ... and adamw for announcing the changes 15:14
jlaska #link http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/test/2011-July/101284.html 15:14
athmane me and adamw updated SOP 15:14
jlaska I think we can close that out 15:15
* vhumpa is awfully late for his portion of lurking 15:15
jlaska vhumpa: welcome lurker! :D 15:15
jlaska okay, on to athmane's topic 15:15
jlaska #topic Cloud SIG - Fedora 15 on Amazon EC2 15:15
jlaska #chair athmane 15:15
zodbot Current chairs: athmane jlaska 15:15
jlaska athmane: feel free to take it away ... otherwise I'll just meetbot the commands you included in the agenda 15:15
athmane ok 15:16
athmane in the last cloud sig we agreed that tomorrow will be the test day 15:16
athmane but we don't yet have f15 ami ids 15:17
athmane #link http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/cloud/2011-July/000670.html 15:17
athmane #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Day:2011-07-19_Cloud_SIG_Fedora_EC2 15:17
jlaska To state the obvious, I assume the event cannot proceed until AMI's are available for testing? 15:17
athmane yes 15:18
rbergeron We have some AMI ID's. 15:18
rbergeron They're just not the ones that were recently recently made 15:18
athmane I meant the newer ami ids 15:18
rbergeron yeah. 15:18
tflink the AMIs are up, but I believe that they were going to be tested before the numbers were sent out 15:18
rbergeron jforbes: ringring 15:18
* rbergeron is working on it. I'll pop back in before end of meeting and report progress 15:19
* jforbes is looking 15:19
adamw should we delay the event now even if the amis turn up today? 15:19
adamw one day isn't too long to get much publicity done 15:20
athmane +1 15:20
jlaska move to Thu? 15:20
j_dulaney +1 on delay 15:20
jlaska or push out 1 week 15:20
rbergeron it's up to you guys - it depends on what you think is best, i can't run a test day. :) 15:20
rbergeron (well, i could, but you know, disaster and all) 15:20
jlaska plenty of breathing room remains in https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/QA/Fedora_16_test_days 15:20
j_dulaney As an aside, it looks like I just booted F16 15:20
j_dulaney Push out a week? 15:21
jforbes Yeah, certainly need to deltay 15:21
rbergeron jlaska: yeah, the key here is that it's fedora 15, so we're already kind of like way behind. 15:21
j_dulaney I'm for that 15:21
athmane jlaska: it's for f15 not f16 15:21
jforbes I am looking right now, rel-eng has not uploaded any new images 15:21
rbergeron okay. 15:21
rbergeron jforbes: let's sort it out and we'll circle back with athmane and tflink to reschedule 15:22
* athmane wonders who'll be available during f15 on ec2 test day 15:22
* rbergeron salutes the QA team for their patience with us and for all their help 15:22
* jforbes will be available, whenever it ends up 15:22
j_dulaney athmane: I will be 15:23
j_dulaney Well, so much for F16 logging in. It booted, though, which is better than my last try 15:23
jlaska athmane: it is ... but that's the test day schedule we need to be looking at for now 15:23
jlaska to avoid conflicts 15:23
tflink I was hoping to get it done before the F16 test days started 15:24
* rbergeron nods 15:24
jlaska yeah, that's a good plan 15:24
jlaska athmane: any particular date in mind for rescheduling, or will that be discussed after meeting? 15:25
athmane jlaska: it's up to cloud sig 15:25
jlaska okay 15:25
jlaska #info F15 AMI's not yet available, will propose rescheduling test day with Cloud Sig. Stay tuned to cloud@lists.fedoraproject.org 15:26
jlaska athmane: anything else you want to highlight on this topic? 15:26
athmane no 15:27
jlaska athmane: okay, thanks for raising this #topic 15:27
jlaska folks can follow the action on cloud@ after the meeting :) 15:27
jlaska #topic Open Discussion - <your topic here> 15:27
jlaska okay, I had nothing else on the agenda for today ... so it's open-mic time 15:28
robatino i was wondering if anyone had any ideas about why the minimum deltaiso size increased in F15 - see http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/test/2011-May/100322.html 15:29
jlaska #chair robatino 15:29
zodbot Current chairs: athmane jlaska robatino 15:29
brunowolff I haven't heard any updates on the grub issue. 15:29
jlaska #topic Minimum Delta-ISO size 15:29
robatino i'm pretty sure it has something to do with https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=646843 15:29
jlaska #info robatino asked .. ."if anyone had any ideas about why the minimum deltaiso size increased in F15" 15:29
jlaska #link http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/test/2011-May/100322.html 15:29
robatino images/install.img will no longer exist in F-15 and newer 15:29
jlaska brunowolff: that's my next TODO .. I'll nudge that issue after the meeting 15:29
brunowolff The 32 bit SMP lockup issue is fixed in Linus' tree, but didn' make it into the kernels built over the weekend. 15:29
jlaska robatino: are the images/install.img and the delta iso two different topics, or related? 15:30
jlaska robatino: hmm, clumens or wwoods might know more regarding the compression of the delta images 15:31
robatino jlaska: it turns out that it has something to do with different netinst images not delta-compressing any more, it must have something to do with the change in the install images 15:31
jlaska your instincts could be correct, the install.img may not compress well, since it's already compressed 15:31
jlaska but ... 15:31
robatino not deltacompressing _well_, i mean - it used to compress by a factor of several, as of F15 it's negligible 15:31
jlaska well ... 15:31
jlaska the content really hasn't changed much between F15 and previous 15:31
jlaska it's just moved from images/install.img into the images/pxeboot/initrd.img 15:32
jlaska so maybe something about the initial ramdisk naturally doesn't lend well to re-compression or something? 15:32
jlaska </wag> 15:32
robatino for example if you run makedeltaiso on 2 successive F14 netinsts, it would be about a factor of 2 or 3 smaller, but not in F15 15:32
robatino quantified in http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/test/2011-May/100449.html 15:32
jlaska #info if you run makedeltaiso on 2 successive F14 netinsts, it would be about a factor of 2 or 3 smaller, but not in F15 15:33
jlaska nice data 15:33
robatino not that big a deal, was wondering if there was some trivial way to fix it 15:33
jlaska I'm just not very experienced with delta-iso ... we can definitely hit up clumens to work through your thoughts on the install.img if you like 15:33
robatino would be nice to get back to a minimum size of 60-70 M instead of about 200 M now 15:33
jlaska yeah 15:34
jlaska otherwise, defeats the purposed I would think 15:34
* adamw thought robatino was the expert on deltaiso 15:34
adamw no point _you_ asking _us_ for help :P 15:34
jlaska he is! 15:34
jlaska I believe robatino is known in some circles as, "Mr. Delta ISO" 15:34
robatino no, i don't really know the internals, jdieter is the expert 15:34
robatino it's just very easy to use which is why i can do it 15:34
jlaska did he have any thoughts on this? 15:35
robatino haven't asked yet, he's been away, i could email anyway 15:35
jlaska s/ [s]he / 15:35
jlaska okay 15:35
jlaska well, lemme know if I can help chase down the install.img angle with you 15:35
jlaska otherwise, we'll stay tuned :) 15:35
jlaska #topic Open Discussion - <your topic here> 15:35
brunowolff Deltaiso might need to get special knowledge of the initrd so it can uncompress another level deep before doing comparisons. 15:36
athmane ovirt spin 15:36
jlaska #topic oVirt Node Fedora 16 Spin 15:36
jlaska #link http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/test/2011-July/101362.html 15:36
jlaska athmane: thanks :) 15:37
athmane I can help with that 15:37
jlaska so, I'm providing guidance to Joey so that they follow a similar model that athmane setup ... that seems like the best approach to me, and works with our existing process 15:37
athmane I asked for kickstart and applications list 15:37
jlaska #info There is a link of "applications"/ tests on the SPIN wiki at https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Ovirt_Node_Spin#Scope_.2F_Testing 15:37
jlaska I don't know if that's explicitly the info you are looking for 15:38
jlaska imo, this seems to fit well with the matrix model we've been using so far ... so unless any other ideas surface, I'll likely keep messaging that route 15:38
athmane well I'll look after the meeting 15:39
jlaska athmane: maybe copy the security SPIN matrix you created with some stubs for the oVirt needs to provide some visualization of what we're talking about? 15:39
jlaska athmane: okay 15:39
jlaska #info Athmane + jlaska will continue discussing options post-meeting 15:39
jlaska #topic Open Discussion - <your topic here> 15:39
jlaska okay ... last call for topics 15:39
athmane is it approved by rel-eng 15:40
jlaska okay ... if nothing else ... we'll #endmeeting in 2 minutes 15:42
jlaska will #endmeeting in 1 minute ... 15:43
jlaska Well ... before ending, I could touch on the last topic ... 15:44
jlaska #topic Next meeting ... 15:44
jlaska #info Monday @ 15:00 UTC, July 25 2011 15:44
jlaska Is anyone interested in #chairing the meeting? 15:44
jlaska If not ... you're stuck with me continuing to nag for topics :) 15:44
jlaska #info jlaska will #chair the meeting next week 15:45
jlaska alrighty ...thanks everything 15:45
jlaska *and everyone :) 15:45
jlaska #endmeeting 15:45

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