ReleaseEngineering/Meetings/2009-feb-02

Fedora Release Engineering Meeting :: Monday 2009-02-02

Delay of Fedora 11 Alpha

• multiple bugs found, and discovered as far back as the original freeze. Attempts to fix the bugs with newer trees brought in different bugs.
• remaining issues with
  • iSCSI
  • iprutils
• Go forward plan:
  1. rebuild ppc with newer iprutils
  2. delay Fedora 11 alpha until 2009-02-05 with approval from FESCo
  3. hold all other schedule dates

gcc 4.4 Mass Rebuilde

• perform prior to beta
• need to iron out a few other issues first
  • compiler flags
  • minimum arch
• going to need a build for gcc4.4, rpm sha256, and font provides
• Features/gcc4.4
• Features/ArchitectureSupport

IRC Transcript

* notting is here		13:13
f13	ping: notting jwb lmacken wwoods rdieter poelcat spot warren	13:13
* jwb is here		13:13
* spot is here		13:13
* poelcat here		13:14
rdieter	yo	13:14
* lmacken is here		13:14
* wwoods here		13:14
f13	neat.	13:15
::: f13 changed the topic of #fedora-meeting to: Fedora releng - ALPHA!!!!		13:15
f13	so... last week sucked.	13:15
f13	multiple bugs found, and discovered as far back as the original freeze. Attempts to fix the bugs with newer trees brought in different bugs.	13:16
jwb	wait	13:16
f13	after a long weekend, I finally found a tree that seems to be "good enough"	13:16
f13	jwb: yes?	13:16
jwb	did you figure out what the differences were between your compose environment and the official one that caused the bugs to be missed?	13:16
f13	no.	13:17
f13	I also didn't spend a whole lot of time on it, particularly because I had to blow away both the local and the remote one due to space issues	13:17
f13	anyway, what we have now is an alpha tag (f11-alpha-2) that has the contents from rawhide-20090130 + a newer nfs-utils package.	13:18
f13	so far, all the tests I've done have passed, including the critical nfs, getting past iscsiadm errors in gui mode, and getting past timezone selection in gui mode.	13:18
f13	The two outstanding bugs that I'm aware of that will likely hit a lot of people is UUID/LABEL mounting of /, and vnc installs	13:19
f13	vnc seems to have stopped working somewhere between the initial freeze and now, however I'm willing to trade vnc for working nfs and graphical installs	13:20
f13	particularly because we don't actually know what fixed a few of these issues, so we don't know what we coudl cherry pick back to an older freeze target to avoid vnc breakage	13:20
* warren here		13:20
jwb	f13, any chance to include the .73 kernel?	13:21
f13	I don't think so, unless we want to slip longer.	13:22
f13	Given where we are today, if the rest of our critical path tests complete OK, we could actually ship on Thursday	13:22
f13	meaning only a 2 day slip.	13:22
* stickster reminds that Tuesday is usually the day for PR value		13:22
f13	that would mean releasing it to mirrors tomorrow, after I spend all day today staging bits around.	13:22
f13	stickster: Alpha is less of a PR target	13:22
f13	its not exactly suitable for press/reviews/masses, it's more of a reliable starting point for developers to get on the rawhide train	13:23
stickster	In one way, yes... the target audience is really people who want to test the raw bits like developers.	13:23
f13	very few features are functional, no artwork, lots of broken things, etc, etc, etc,...	13:23
stickster	However, we also have a mandate to get our features plenty of PR early on in the process.	13:23
f13	stickster: I'd happily trade 4 days of development time for some extra Alpha PR	13:24
stickster	Just wanted to make sure rel-eng was aware of that issue	13:24
f13	particularly because we asked for a full 6 month schedule so that we could avoid slips :/	13:25
stickster	But if the week translates into slip time, then frankly I'd rather just get Alpha out there.	13:25
stickster	I'd be much more concerned about the PR aspect were this the Beta.	13:25
f13	I would too	13:25
f13	but beta is a blocking freeze and we likely would have had more help finding issues	13:25
* stickster nods and sits down		13:26
wwoods	I've got a fix for a ppc blocker that should be building shortly, but... I don't think we care about ppc that much	13:26
f13	wwoods: I still wasnt sure if we were producing ppc alpha images	13:28
f13	that's jwb's call	13:28
jwb	f13, if you can mash the buttons, we can produce them. rawhide install last week at least worked for some subset of PPC	13:29
f13	also on the very scary list, live images. I've been trying to find a tree to make real installs work, that I haven't produced live images in a while from a rc tree to test.	13:29
* wwoods wondering about KVM status, reading scrollback		13:30
f13	wwoods: what's the nature of the blocker fix? (he asks has he watches the rest of the evening slip away)	13:30
f13	wwoods: all my kvm installs have gone fine	13:30
jwb	f13, patching iprutils to not hang forever when iprdump starts	13:30
wwoods	f13: new iprutils package	13:30
jwb	i'm doing a local build here and i'll even test it	13:30
jwb	unless you already tested it wwoods ?	13:31
wwoods	yeah, I tested a build locally	13:31
wwoods	WORKSFORME	13:31
wwoods	but I'd like confirmation, esp. with something built from koji	13:31
jwb	ok. then once this mockbuild finishes to make sure i didn't screw up something, i'll commit it and tag/build	13:31
jwb	will let you know when that is done	13:31
f13	what happens if we don't have this?	13:32
jwb	ppc hangs forever on start	13:32
jwb	because iprdump isn't running as a daemon	13:32
wwoods	and, for some reason, we install and run that on all ppc, regardless of whether they actually have the hardware	13:33
wwoods	or want dumping\	13:33
f13	did something recently change to cause it to start hanging?	13:34
jwb	unknown. lack of boot.iso for a while didn't help there	13:35
f13	is there an easy workaround for this?	13:35
wwoods	boot to runlevel 1, disable iprdump (or fix its initscript)	13:36
jwb	single user, chkconfig iprdump off	13:36
f13	hrm.	13:36
jwb	or do it via kickstart or someting	13:36
f13	iprutils is only ppc right?	13:36
wwoods	yep.	13:36
f13	I could just re-compose ppc with that build in, and not have to touch anything else.	13:36
jwb	hm	13:37
f13	jwb: now you want a kernel too	13:37
jwb	you are psychic	13:37
jwb	the oopses appeared to be non-fatal	13:38
wwoods	I'm not sure if I'd done any ppc installs before now, or if F10 installed iprutils	13:38
jwb	we could likely live without the kernel bump, but i dunno	13:38
f13	if it works to get to yum...	13:38
jwb	it does	13:39
jwb	well with the iprutils fix/workaround	13:39
wwoods	I think probably I just hadn't done any ppc rawhide installs since iprdump got its new upstream (Nov. 21)	13:39
f13	ok, no kernel for you	13:39
jwb	iprutils is building in koji right now	13:39
f13	ok.	13:41
f13	Proposal: re-spin ppc with new iprutils, no other changes.	13:41
warren	I know nothing about this, so can't vote on it.	13:42
notting	schedule impact is?	13:42
f13	notting: it'll take about 40 minutes to respin ppc	13:43
f13	no other arch needs to change	13:43
f13	so no significant schedule impact.	13:43
notting	then +1	13:43
wwoods	hrm. my ppc DVD gave me the iscsi asplode	13:44
wwoods	f13, are those images still syncing or something?	13:44
wwoods	anyway, +1, since the fix is fairly obvious and the worst possible outcome is.. ppc still doesn't work right	13:45
f13	wwoods: shouldn't be, what sha1 do you have?	13:45
wwoods	much to the disappointment of all 9 users	13:45
wwoods	f13: hang on while I sha1 the DVD	13:46
f13	7d769b9f52e4a70802bab5106f6aa7b480bd34c1 is what I have	13:46
wwoods	it'd be quicker if you just gave me the timestamp from .discinfo	13:48
wwoods	oh wait, it finished. yeah, that's the sha1 i have	13:48
f13	that would involve loopback mounting and...	13:48
f13	wwoods: thats.... unfortunate.	13:48
f13	ppc work around, use text.	13:49
jwb	vnc install worked for me friday	13:49
wwoods	f13: alias discinfo='isoinfo -x /.discinfo -i'	13:50
f13	ah	13:50
f13	iso-info ?	13:50
wwoods	discinfo ~/[wwoods@metroid devel]$ rpm -qf $(which isoinfo)	13:51
wwoods	genisoimage-1.1.8-1.fc10.i386	13:51
wwoods	blerg. you get the point	13:51
wwoods	f13: ppc GUI was assumed to be a no-op anyway	13:51
wwoods	I'll try vnc/TUI	13:51
jwb	yes, agreed	13:52
f13	-x isn't a valid option	13:52
jwb	i don't even think i tried to boot into X on pc	13:52
jwb	er, ppc	13:52
jwb	and when the GUI install tried, it vomited	13:52
wwoods	but I thought the iscsi "ValueError: need more than 0 values.." trace was gone	13:52
jwb	presumably due to the SELinux thing	13:52
* f13 wonders why we have iso-info and isoinfo		13:52
f13	wwoods: no, those errors still happen, it's just not causing a traceback at least on i386/x86_64 gui	13:53
f13	wwoods: we don't fully understand /why/ we were getting a trace there to begin with	13:53
wwoods	yeah, isoinfo (from genisoimage) not iso-info (from libcdio)	13:53
f13	stuuuupid	13:53
f13	alright so we have a plan for ppc	13:54
f13	I'm going to get on that, start making some jigdo images for the i386/x86_^4 trees and syncing them to the master mirror, so that I can clear up space to start making live images.	13:54
f13	I'll get some live images staged for testing at some point today	13:55
f13	Proposal: Finish testing current tree and live images, propose 2 day slip for alpha release on Thursday	13:58
poelcat	f13: implied is that we hold to all other existing dates?	13:59
f13	poelcat: yes.	13:59
notting	meh. what are the chances we'll have to re-revise on testing?	13:59
f13	notting: the known problems are fixed, it's the unknown problems, but we're getting pretty past the usual install methods, into the realm of "would be nice, but meh"	13:59
notting	and, of course, the usual "how do we avoid this in the future?"	14:00
notting	but that's a separate discussion. +1 to the proposal	14:00
warren	just go ahead	14:01
* poelcat +1		14:01
f13	so I don't think there is a FESCo meeting before tuesday, question is how do we get an emergency vote?	14:02
poelcat	f13: file a ticket?	14:02
f13	probably, and send out an email	14:02
bpepple	poelcat: yeah, that would probably be the best bet.	14:02
jwb	do we have a majority here?	14:03
jwb	nirik, jds2001, dwmw2, sharkcz, ping	14:03
sharkcz	jwb: pong	14:03
f13	ok, I"ll file the ticket.	14:03
* nirik is around.		14:03
::: f13 changed the topic of #fedora-meeting to: Fedora releng - open floor		14:03
f13	any last minute items?	14:04
* notting swaps hats, reiiterates his vote		14:04
jwb	sharkcz, nevermind. i guess we're moving on :)	14:04
dwmw2	jwb?	14:04
jwb	was going to see if we could call an emergency fesco vote, but *shrug*	14:04
f13	jwb: I'm pretty sure ramming this through a sudden IRC vote will piss off at least 2 people.	14:04
jwb	f13, name the 2	14:04
poelcat	f13: gcc4.4 mass rebuild ... when do we need to plan that on the schedule?	14:04
f13	poelcat: prior to beta.	14:04
jwb	f13, and explain to me how they are involved in this in any manner	14:04
warren	poelcat: still havent' decidded what the compiler flags and minimum arch will be	14:05
f13	poelcat: IIRC we're going to need a build for gcc4.4, rpm sha256, and font provides.	14:05
jwb	warren, that can be changed later	14:05
notting	jwb: not after the mass rebuild	14:05
f13	poelcat: they should all be done at the same time, rather than 3 different builds.	14:05
jwb	notting, oh, i misread	14:05
jwb	i thought it was jsut bringing gcc 4.4 in	14:05
poelcat	Features/gcc4.4	14:06
warren	jwb: part of the decision is to make the minimum arch i486 or i586 (as jakub suggested earlier) or maybe even i686	14:06
warren	jwb: so that's a pretty big deal that needs to be decided	14:06
jwb	yes yes, i'm aware of that. i said i misread	14:06
poelcat	Features/ArchitectureSupport	14:06
f13	ok, if there is nothing else, I'll close the meeting. Lots of work to do.	14:12
f13	thanks all	14:12

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