QA/Meetings/20120514

Attendees

• adamw (172)
• tflink (125)
• j_dulaney (45)
• dgilmore (37)
• kparal (32)
• nirik (26)
• brunowolff (20)
• maxamillion (12)
• drago01 (8)
• spot (7)
• jskladan (6)
• zodbot (6)
• cmurf (6)
• pjones (5)
• pschindl (5)
• rbergeron (2)
• fossjon (1)
• satellit_ (1)

Agenda

• Previous meeting follow-up
• Fedora 17 Final status / planning
• Test Day report
• Upcoming QA events
• Pending RHBZ Upgrade
• AutoQA update
• Open floor

Previous meeting follow-up

• adamw to check in on Boxes test day once more - test day has been moved out once more and looks like it may actually happen now

Fedora 17 Final status/planning

Blocker review

• #820366 is rejected as a blocker - other testers have been unable to reproduce the issue described and with the information currently available, this is not severe enough to warrant blocker status
• #813648 is accepted as a blocker - violates the 'must boot to working desktop' criterion
• #820985 is accepted as a blocker - violates the F17 alpha release criterion "The installer must be able to report failures to Bugzilla and local disk, with appropriate information included" for detected duplicates once Bugzilla is upgraded
• #821122 is accepted as a blocker - violates the Fedora 17 alpha criterion "There must be no file conflicts (cases where the files in some packages conflict but the packages have explicit Conflicts: tags are acceptable) or unresolved package dependencies during a media-based (DVD) install"

Upcoming QA events

• GNOME Boxes Test Day on 2012-05-17 - j_dulaney to do some promotion
• Go/no-go scheduled for Thursday 2012-05-17

Pending RHBZ Upgrade

• Currently scheduled for 2012-05-19
• Will break some stuff, waiting to find out how badly
  • libreport blocker filed for F17, will likely affect earlier releases
  • blocker wiki page will no longer work
  • Other scripts using python-bugzilla will likely not work after upgrade
  • Waiting on testing this week to find out how badly bodhi will be impacted
• tflink will look into fixes for the broken tools after F17 is done

AutoQA update

• No news, due to F17 testing

Open floor

• nirik will be updating boot.fedoraproject.org for F17, he welcomes input and testing
• adamw and tflink will check status of #810104 with TC5
• #820973 is no longer considered a blocker as the menu entry works as intended, but upstream has not yet written the online documentation to which it points

Action items

• j_dulaney to actually do his job and promote the GNOME boxes test day
• adamw and tflink to check status of #810104 with TC5
• adamw to create some shared bugzilla searches for F17 final blocker/nth to replace the wiki page

IRC Log

adamw	#startmeeting Fedora QA meeting	15:01
zodbot	Meeting started Mon May 14 15:01:31 2012 UTC. The chair is adamw. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.	15:01
zodbot	Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.	15:01
adamw	#meetingname fedora-qa	15:01
zodbot	The meeting name has been set to 'fedora-qa'	15:01
adamw	#topic roll call	15:01
* pschindl is here		15:01
* satellit_ listening		15:02
* tflink is here		15:02
adamw	oh goody, lots of people for blocker fun!	15:02
* kparal can't miss it		15:02
* jskladan tips his hat		15:02
* brunowolff is here		15:03
adamw	how much do you generally tip your hat, anyway? 10%?	15:03
* nirik is lurking around		15:03
tflink	adamw: depends on how quickly my hat brings me drinks and food	15:03
* maxamillion is here		15:04
adamw	alrighty, let's get going	15:04
adamw	#topic Previous meeting follow-up	15:05
adamw	just the eternal topic on the list, "adamw to check in on Boxes test day once more"	15:05
adamw	it's now set for 2012-05-17 and, who knows, may even happen then.,	15:05
kparal	exciting	15:06
maxamillion	exciting indeed	15:06
adamw	now both Duke Nukem Forever and Chinese Democracy exist, I have no idea what to compare it to. =)	15:06
maxamillion	is there a wiki page for that test day?	15:06
tflink	adamw: halflife 2 episode 3	15:06
adamw	ooh, good one.	15:06
maxamillion	equality in america?	15:06
maxamillion	>.>	15:06
adamw	https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Day:2012-05-17_Gnome_Boxes	15:06
kparal	maxamillion: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Test_Day:2012-05-17_Gnome_Boxes	15:06
adamw	ooh, political!	15:06
* maxamillion is very bitter about the NC crap even though he doesn't live there		15:07
* adamw is bitter about many things but aims to keep them out of QA meetings		15:07
maxamillion	adamw, kparal: thanks for the linkage	15:07
maxamillion	adamw: fair point	15:07
adamw	#info "adamw to check in on Boxes test day once more": test day has been moved out once more and looks like it may actually happen now	15:08
adamw	#topic Fedora 17 Final status/planning	15:08
adamw	welp, here's the big one	15:08
maxamillion	so gnome boxes is a front end to kvm? ... like virt-manager?	15:08
adamw	maxam: more or less, yeah. also, vnc.	15:09
maxamillion	rgr	15:09
adamw	because it seemed to logically go together, apparently.	15:09
tflink	adamw: I have IRC stuff prepped we want to do a blocker-review here	15:09
adamw	yeah, at least the proposed blockers, i think	15:09
adamw	#topic Fedora 17 Final status/planning: mini-blocker review	15:10
adamw	take it away, tflink	15:10
tflink	adamw: chair?	15:10
adamw	shoot	15:11
adamw	#chair tflink	15:11
zodbot	Current chairs: adamw tflink	15:11
adamw	#chair kparal	15:11
zodbot	Current chairs: adamw kparal tflink	15:11
tflink	#topic (820366) Cannot boot 17 Beta installer: /dev/root does not exist	15:11
tflink	#link http://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=820366	15:11
tflink	#info Proposed Blocker, NEW	15:11
adamw	#chair maxamillion	15:11
zodbot	Current chairs: adamw kparal maxamillion tflink	15:11
* j_dulaney waves		15:11
* tflink remembers talking with the reporter about this over IRC		15:12
adamw	bcl seems baffled	15:13
tflink	I still think that we need more info	15:13
tflink	it would be helpful if the reporter could try a public mirror	15:13
adamw	have you verified you can still do PXE installs fine?	15:13
maxamillion	o.O'	15:13
tflink	not with TC5, no	15:13
tflink	TC4 worked, though	15:13
j_dulaney	If bcl is baffled, then, wow	15:13
kparal	I booted TC5 anaconda over PXE today, all fine	15:14
* j_dulaney did pxe with TC5		15:14
kparal	I did not finish the installation though, just booted installer	15:14
j_dulaney	What kparal said	15:14
adamw	still, it booted	15:14
kparal	yes	15:14
kparal	i386	15:14
adamw	i just wanted to be sure we had enough 'it works' confidence	15:14
tflink	when I was talking with the reporter, he was attempting PXE with a different initrd/vmlinuz than was on the mirror he was using	15:14
tflink	he kept changing that up, though	15:15
adamw	in general i'd be okay with punting, but we don't really have a whole lot of punting room at this point	15:15
adamw	i'm inclined to go -1 on the info that PXE works for at least two others and probably three	15:15
* j_dulaney is -1 blocker at this point		15:15
tflink	we don't have enough information, what else can we do other than reject it?	15:15
tflink	reject or punt	15:15
pjones	I think we've actually seen, very infrequently, reports along these lines for past distros as well, and never could figure it out	15:16
pjones	tflink: if nobody else can reproduce it, it certainly isn't a blocker	15:16
adamw	pjones: i just worry about the case where we finally realize 'oh yeah, he has (some trivial difference in config to our other testers) and that triggers a genuine bug'	15:17
tflink	pjones: assuming that we're not doing something different enough to not hit whatever the reporter is hitting	15:17
adamw	but it doesn't seem like a huge likelihood at this point, and we can always re-vote it.	15:17
tflink	true	15:17
adamw	so, -1	15:17
tflink	-1	15:17
* nirik is -1 given what we know currently		15:17
pjones	adamw: and if he does - how much configuration is there really in terms of booting the network install image? I'm inclined to say you're talking about /misconfiguring/ something.	15:17
brunowolff	-1 blocker	15:17
* pjones obs -1 as well		15:18
kparal	-1	15:18
adamw	pjones: true.	15:18
tflink	proposed #agreed - 820336 - RejectedBlocker - Other testers have been unable to reproduce the issue described and with the information currently available, this is not severe enough to warrant blocker status.	15:18
rbergeron	ack	15:18
j_dulaney	ack	15:19
kparal	ack	15:19
pschindl	ack	15:19
tflink	#agreed - 820336 - RejectedBlocker - Other testers have been unable to reproduce the issue described and with the information currently available, this is not severe enough to warrant blocker status.	15:19
tflink	#topic (813648) gnome-shell shows blank windows on hardware lacking NPOT textures	15:19
tflink	#link http://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=813648	15:19
tflink	#info Proposed Blocker, MODIFIED	15:19
tflink	was this pulled in to TC5?	15:20
adamw	yipe!	15:21
adamw	ironically as this bug came up, my entire desktop suddenly started blacking out	15:21
adamw	two windows disappeared, then rapidly, all the other interface elements...	15:21
adamw	tflink: I believe i put it in, yeah	15:21
kparal	we need someone to test it	15:22
tflink	adamw: yes, it was in the TC5 request	15:22
drago01	kparal: easy to test on any hardware	15:22
adamw	drago01: disable a GL extension?	15:22
kparal	it needs to be old nvidia	15:22
drago01	kparal: just run gnome-shell --cogl-debug=disable-npot-textures --replace	15:22
j_dulaney	adamw: Yeah, I've had my whole screen blanking out then coming back, but not just under Gnome	15:23
drago01	kparal: no	15:23
kparal	ah	15:23
drago01	kparal: you can force it to use that code path	15:23
* j_dulaney hasn't quite figured the cause, so no bug report just yet		15:23
adamw	can you put that info in the bug / update request, drago? thanks!	15:23
* kparal is testing it		15:23
tflink	so, any thoughts on blockery-ness?	15:24
drago01	adamw: 1) ajax already did 2) don't seem to have enough powers to edit the update despite being provenpacker	15:24
kparal	+1 blocker, we need to either fix or blacklist	15:24
adamw	at the last meeting it looks like you kinda fudged this one	15:25
adamw	took it as nth and left blocker status open	15:25
* j_dulaney is also +1 blocker		15:25
adamw	fwiw i always figured that if we took the low VRAM bug as a blocker we should logically take this too: most hardware affected by low VRAM is also NPOT	15:25
tflink	yeah, there wasn't a consensus on whether or not it was blocker material	15:25
drago01	yeah having black textures instead of windows is a clear blocker	15:25
drago01	+1	15:25
adamw	so there's not much point fixing the low VRAM bug and not fixing this, because it'll help almost no-one	15:25
adamw	just a few NV4x users like kparal	15:26
tflink	if this was the last blocker bug left, would we slip for it?	15:26
adamw	tflink: i would slip if for some reason we couldn't write a blacklist, yes.	15:26
adamw	it'd take me 20 seconds to write a blacklist, of course. :)	15:26
* rbergeron grins		15:26
tflink	don't we already have a blacklist, though?	15:26
adamw	not for this hardware.	15:27
adamw	er, possibly we do, actually. lemme check exactly what went into beta.	15:27
adamw	yeah, we only blacklisted NV30 for beta.	15:27
adamw	so I think we're actually trying to render Shell on NV10/NV20.	15:27
kparal	I can confirm the fix using that reproducer	15:28
brunowolff	I have an nv28 that I run in fallback mode that works fine.	15:28
tflink	looks like we're mostly +1 blocker today	15:28
adamw	brunowolff: but if you set it to Shell, it probably doesn't render it right?	15:29
brunowolff	I think the actual effect is a blocker, but I don't know the number of people that will be affected.	15:29
adamw	we could pull numbers from smolt. i'd ballpark it in the low single digits %age-wise.	15:29
adamw	low single *whole* digits, though. :)	15:30
brunowolff	I don't usually use the shell, because I don't like it. There was a point about a month ago where I used the shell by mistake and it broke things.	15:30
pjones	adamw: .9 is plural.	15:30
brunowolff	I haven't tried it again since. So I don't know the current status.	15:30
tflink	proposed #agreed - 813648 - AcceptedBlocker - violates "Following on from the previous criterion, after firstboot is completed and on subsequent boots, a system installed according to any of the above criteria (or the appropriate Beta or Final criteria, when applying this criterion to those releases) must boot to a working graphical environment without unintended user intervention. This includes correctly accessing any encrypted partitions when the co	15:31
brunowolff	I think a few percent would be significant and worth blocking for.	15:31
tflink	that criterion is too long :(	15:31
adamw	tflink: yeah, i keep loading it up.	15:31
adamw	ack	15:31
brunowolff	ack	15:31
kparal	ack	15:31
drago01	tflink: just assign them numbers so that you can say violates cirterion #X	15:31
j_dulaney	ack	15:32
kparal	numbers change in time	15:32
tflink	#agreed - 813648 - AcceptedBlocker - violates "Following on from the previous criterion, after firstboot is completed and on subsequent boots, a system installed according to any of the above criteria (or the appropriate Beta or Final criteria, when applying this criterion to those releases) must boot to a working graphical environment without unintended user intervention. This includes correctly accessing any encrypted partitions when the correct pas	15:32
tflink	#topic (820985) Searching for duplicate anaconda bugs while reporting exception against partner-bugzilla during install fails	15:32
tflink	#link http://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=820985	15:32
tflink	#info Proposed Blocker, MODIFIED	15:32
tflink	this is a pretty clear cut blocker to me	15:33
adamw	well...what data do we lose?	15:33
tflink	proposed #agreed - 820985 - AcceptedBlocker - Violates the F17 alpha release criterion "The installer must be able to report failures to Bugzilla and local disk, with appropriate information included" once bugzilla.redhat.com is upgraded	15:33
adamw	the info that multiple people are hitting the bug, i guess	15:34
tflink	adamw: duplicate reporting and it looks bad	15:34
adamw	all the bugs would still get reported	15:34
* adamw just trying to be careful :)		15:34
tflink	"hey, we hit this problem but we won't let you report it"	15:34
kparal	sometimes the duplicate detection is totally wrong	15:34
tflink	the failure mode doesn't say anything about why, just failes with issue (null)	15:34
j_dulaney	Goes against the bug reporting criterion, I think	15:35
adamw	tflink: where's that commit from?	15:35
* j_dulaney is +1 blocker		15:35
tflink	adamw: libreport, I think	15:35
adamw	j_dulaney: yeah, it's a conditional breakage of that criterion in the case of 'reporting a dupe bug'	15:35
tflink	I don't think we have a new build yet, though	15:35
kparal	ack	15:35
adamw	tflink: note you'll want the next patch in the series too	15:36
adamw	as the first one just unconditionally changes to 'id'	15:36
adamw	so it'd break existing bugzilla instead =) the next one queries version and DTRT	15:36
adamw	okay, ack.	15:36
tflink	proposed #agreed - 820985 - AcceptedBlocker - Violates the F17 alpha release criterion "The installer must be able to report failures to Bugzilla and local disk, with appropriate information included" for detected duplicates once bugzilla.redhat.com is upgraded	15:36
kparal	ack	15:37
brunowolff	ack	15:37
tflink	#agreed - 820985 - AcceptedBlocker - Violates the F17 alpha release criterion "The installer must be able to report failures to Bugzilla and local disk, with appropriate information included" for detected duplicates once bugzilla.redhat.com is upgraded	15:37
tflink	#topic (821122) repoclosure failure on 17.TC5 DVDs (zif)	15:37
tflink	#link http://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=821122	15:37
tflink	#info Proposed Blocker, NEW	15:37
adamw	well, ack, repoclosure. but how did this happen?	15:37
adamw	dgilmore: ?	15:37
adamw	hum. i see two versions of PackageKit in the file list.	15:38
dgilmore	adamw: it failed because we exclude every javadoc package	15:38
tflink	proposed #agreed - 821122 - AcceptedBlocker - Violates the Fedora 17 alpha criterion "There must be no file conflicts (cases where the files in some packages conflict but the packages have explicit Conflicts: tags are acceptable) or unresolved package dependencies during a media-based (DVD) install"	15:39
j_dulaney	+1 blocker	15:39
adamw	this is PackageKit-zif.	15:39
dgilmore	i tried a few things to pull in just the one requested	15:39
j_dulaney	ack	15:39
kparal	acl	15:39
adamw	dgilmore: wrong bug.	15:39
dgilmore	adamw: im going to have to remove the removal of javadoc packages	15:39
brunowolff	Pungi will pull in all matches, so if two versions are available, I think you get both.	15:39
tflink	#agreed - 821122 - AcceptedBlocker - Violates the Fedora 17 alpha criterion "There must be no file conflicts (cases where the files in some packages conflict but the packages have explicit Conflicts: tags are acceptable) or unresolved package dependencies during a media-based (DVD) install"	15:39
brunowolff	ack	15:39
dgilmore	adamw: what bug is it?	15:39
j_dulaney	kparal: Atlantic Coast Line	15:39
adamw	https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=813648 . wrong version of PackageKit-zif on the DVD.	15:39
dgilmore	adamw: the mysql one the package wasnt pushed to stable so we have bothe versions	15:39
tflink	j_dulaney: access control list :)	15:39
dgilmore	adamw: we exclude PackageKit-zif from being on the dvd	15:40
adamw	well, that doesn't appear to be working	15:40
adamw	i think i can see part of the answer	15:40
adamw	PackageKit has an open-ended "Requires: PackageKit-backend"	15:40
adamw	still, no, that doesn't explain why it'd pull an old zif...gr.	15:40
adamw	oh hey, i linked the wrong bug. heh.	15:41
brunowolff	dgilmore: I add some more info to bug 819138 that might allow us to exclude javadoc stuff without adding two many lines to the ks file.	15:41
adamw	dgilmore: sorry, it's https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=821122 . still can't see why it'd happen, though. i'm guessing it's somehow related to both PK builds being on the DVD, but that's as far as I can getr.	15:41
brunowolff	I haven't properly tested it thow.	15:41
* jskladan is back after interwebz failure		15:41
dgilmore	adamw: there is a packagekit update in the bleed repo	15:42
adamw	dgilmore: yes.	15:42
dgilmore	adamw: some subpackage must have changed arch or something to cause both to be pulled in	15:42
j_dulaney	So, why exactly are we bringing in two PK builds?	15:42
adamw	j_dulaney: it sometimes happens when we want to pull in a new build from the side repo	15:43
adamw	since the older build is still in the main repo	15:43
j_dulaney	Ah	15:43
adamw	depending on dependencies (hah), that can result in both winding up on the media	15:43
dgilmore	adamw: and my run of repoclosure on the tc5 tree did not show any PackageKit issues	15:43
adamw	dgilmore: i guess we can just see what happens with TC6/RC1 if we do a stable push first	15:44
* j_dulaney doesn't quite see how that makes sense		15:44
dgilmore	Repos looked at: 1	15:44
dgilmore	f17-TC5	15:44
dgilmore	Num Packages in Repos: 3346	15:44
dgilmore	package: 1:eclipse-jdt-4.2.0-0.20.I201205031800.fc17.x86_64 from f17-TC5	15:44
dgilmore	unresolved deps:	15:44
dgilmore	java-javadoc >= 1:1.7.0	15:44
dgilmore	package: 1:mysql-connector-java-5.1.17-4.fc17.x86_64 from f17-TC5	15:44
dgilmore	unresolved deps:	15:44
dgilmore	libgcj_bc.so.1()(64bit)	15:44
dgilmore	java-gcj-compat >= 0:1.0.31	15:44
dgilmore	java-gcj-compat >= 0:1.0.31	15:44
dgilmore	thats what i got and what i expected	15:44
adamw	j_dulaney: see https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=819139 for one example of a case where it happens	15:44
adamw	dgilmore: what do you think of the 'push it stable and try again' plan?	15:45
dgilmore	adamw: i pushed stable what i could on friday	15:45
adamw	we'd need more karma on https://admin.fedoraproject.org/updates/FEDORA-2012-7740 , everyone.	15:45
adamw	yeah, we can get some karma in and do another.	15:45
j_dulaney	Testing	15:46
tflink	is FESCo right after us or is there an hour gap?	15:46
kparal	FESCo is from 17 UTC	15:46
fossjon	y wud a bug fix need karma lol just apply it man	15:47
maxamillion	adamw: firing up a VM, should have karma in shortly	15:47
tflink	ok, just making sure	15:47
tflink	fossjon: assuming that your question was more serious than your phrasing - because it could cause regressions that are worse than the current situation	15:48
j_dulaney	Dang it, getting mirror wonkiness	15:48
dgilmore	adamw: the issue with PackageKit is the update dropped 5 subpackages	15:48
j_dulaney	There we go	15:48
adamw	dgilmore: i checked that zif was in there, though?	15:48
dgilmore	well maybe not	15:48
dgilmore	adamw: yeah seems we dropped the excluding of zif somewhere	15:49
dgilmore	adamw: need to add that back	15:49
adamw	okay	15:49
tflink	that's all of the proposed blockers	15:49
j_dulaney	packagekit updating, will test when complete	15:49
adamw	can people vote on proposed NTH in the bug reports, please?	15:50
adamw	i'll go through and gather up votes later	15:50
* nirik sees 820750 is bouncing back and forth between anaconda and desktop. Fun times. ;(		15:50
* tflink will put together a requested blocker karma/testing/voting email after this meeting		15:51
dgilmore	adamw: but when i ran repoclosure on the TC5 tree i did not see https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=821122	15:51
dgilmore	adamw: so i dont know how robitno did	15:51
* j_dulaney added PK karma		15:52
adamw	dgilmore: ran it on the media not the tree?	15:53
nirik	if it was excluded from the dvd, and they installed, repoclosure would see it as missing because only the old one is in the repos...	15:53
* adamw will brb, call of nature		15:53
adamw	if someone wants to move on through the agenda, please do	15:53
dgilmore	adamw: the tree is the media	15:53
dgilmore	ls /srv/pungi/17.TC5/17-TC5/Fedora/x86_64/os/Packages/p/PackageKit-*	15:53
dgilmore	/srv/pungi/17.TC5/17-TC5/Fedora/x86_64/os/Packages/p/PackageKit-0.7.4-1.fc17.x86_64.rpm /srv/pungi/17.TC5/17-TC5/Fedora/x86_64/os/Packages/p/PackageKit-gstreamer-plugin-0.7.	15:53
adamw	note the go/no-go has been moved to thursday	15:53
dgilmore	/srv/pungi/17.TC5/17-TC5/Fedora/x86_64/os/Packages/p/PackageKit-0.7.4-2.fc17.x86_64.rpm /srv/pungi/17.TC5/17-TC5/Fedora/x86_64/os/Packages/p/PackageKit-gtk3-module-0.7.4-2.f	15:53
dgilmore	/srv/pungi/17.TC5/17-TC5/Fedora/x86_64/os/Packages/p/PackageKit-command-not-found-0.7.4-2.fc17.x86_64.rpm /srv/pungi/17.TC5/17-TC5/Fedora/x86_64/os/Packages/p/PackageKit-qt-0.7.4-2.fc17.x86_6	15:53
dgilmore	/srv/pungi/17.TC5/17-TC5/Fedora/x86_64/os/Packages/p/PackageKit-device-rebind-0.7.4-2.fc17.x86_64.rpm /srv/pungi/17.TC5/17-TC5/Fedora/x86_64/os/Packages/p/PackageKit-yum-0.7.4-2.fc17.x86_	15:54
dgilmore	/srv/pungi/17.TC5/17-TC5/Fedora/x86_64/os/Packages/p/PackageKit-glib-0.7.4-1.fc17.x86_64.rpm /srv/pungi/17.TC5/17-TC5/Fedora/x86_64/os/Packages/p/PackageKit-yum-plugin-0.7.4-2.fc	15:54
dgilmore	/srv/pungi/17.TC5/17-TC5/Fedora/x86_64/os/Packages/p/PackageKit-glib-0.7.4-2.fc17.x86_64.rpm /srv/pungi/17.TC5/17-TC5/Fedora/x86_64/os/Packages/p/PackageKit-zif-0.7.4-1.fc17.x86_	15:54
* kparal notes PackageKit-0.7.4-2.fc17 now has enough karma for stable repo		15:54
dgilmore	thats pretty clearly not right though	15:54
nirik	yeah. ;(	15:54
tflink	anything else on this or are we good to move on?	15:55
tflink	moving on, then :)	15:56
tflink	#topic Upcoming QA Events	15:56
tflink	looking a the agenda, there are 2 events coming up	15:56
tflink	#info GNOME Boxes test day scheduled for 2012-05-17	15:56
* nirik has an item for open floor when that arrives.		15:56
* tflink hasn't looked into it himself but hears that it might actually happen this time		15:57
* jskladan sacrifices a pig...		15:57
j_dulaney	Can I have the bacon?	15:57
tflink	nirik: ok, will ping you @ open floor when we get there	15:57
* j_dulaney will actually do his job and promote it		15:58
tflink	how confidant are we that it'll actually happen this time?	15:58
tflink	they should probably update those media links :)	15:58
tflink	I see test cases, though	15:58
jskladan	pschindl might know, if he's still into that	15:59
tflink	the matrix needs to be updated but that should be pretty easy	15:59
pschindl	I wasn't working on it this week	15:59
adamw	back	15:59
tflink	but I'm not sure there is much we can do from our end right now	15:59
pschindl	but I think it's on good way	15:59
tflink	#action j_dulaney to actually do his job and promote the GNOME boxes test day	16:00
* j_dulaney is writing the blog post even now		16:00
tflink	adamw: ok, I think we're pretty much done with discussing the GNOME boxes test day	16:00
tflink	the only other thing is the go/no-go meeting on thursday 2012-05-17	16:02
tflink	not much to say there, either	16:02
tflink	need an RC, need testing :)	16:02
tflink	I think that's it for upcoming events, though	16:02
cmurf	when is RC expected?	16:02
j_dulaney	Never	16:03
tflink	cmurf: soon :)	16:03
cmurf	I suspected this answer.	16:03
adamw	#info go/no-go has been rescheduled to 2012-05-17	16:03
adamw	cmurf: you can pick either. :P	16:03
cmurf	Wait what are my choices again?	16:04
tflink	"real soon now" and "never"	16:04
j_dulaney	I was first with a reply, so my answer takes precedence	16:04
j_dulaney	!	16:04
cmurf	These are binary options?	16:04
adamw	oh, for the love of...	16:05
spot	as thrilling as this is...	16:06
adamw	now my desktop has hit another damn bug. sigh.	16:06
adamw	#topic AutoQA update	16:06
adamw	#info no news due to Final testing	16:06
adamw	#topic open floor	16:06
adamw	floor is open for an extremely limited engagement	16:06
spot	820973	16:06
spot	can we revisit that quickly?	16:06
cmurf	Bug 810104 needs to be reopened I think	16:06
tflink	adamw: you missed a topic	16:06
adamw	yes	16:06
adamw	tflink: what did I miss?	16:06
j_dulaney	tflink: He closed it	16:06
tflink	adamw: pending RHBZ awesomeness	16:07
adamw	tflink: oh. well, i thought you said we were done with upcoming events.	16:07
tflink	I wasn't thinking of it as an upcoming event, I guess	16:07
tflink	more of a question of how much we care about our current tools	16:07
adamw	tflink: oh, you made it a sub-topic of upcoming events in the agenda.	16:07
* kparal is confused		16:08
tflink	yeah, I screwed up the formatting	16:08
adamw	#topic Open floor: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=820973	16:08
adamw	so, see comment #2, i'm okay with considering it not a blocker on the basis the menu item actually works as intende	16:08
adamw	s	16:08
adamw	intended. grr.	16:08
kparal	no changes needed in software -> no bug	16:08
j_dulaney	+1	16:08
* spot isn't even sure it merits a NTH, since no package update would be needed		16:08
* j_dulaney will go for that		16:09
kparal	we can't force transmission upstream to create those pages	16:09
adamw	yeah, i don't see what we can change as nth	16:09
kparal	just close NOTABUG or CANTFIX	16:09
j_dulaney	CANTFIX better	16:09
tflink	CANTFIX seems closer in this case	16:09
adamw	propose #agreed #820973 is no longer considered a blocker as the menu entry works as intended, but upstream has not yet written the online documentation to which it points	16:10
jskladan	ack	16:10
tflink	ack	16:10
spot	ackity ack	16:10
pschindl	ack	16:10
kparal	ack	16:10
j_dulaney	ack	16:10
adamw	#agreed #820973 is no longer considered a blocker as the menu entry works as intended, but upstream has not yet written the online documentation to which it points	16:11
adamw	someone suggested...	16:11
adamw	#topic Open floor: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=810104	16:11
adamw	cmurf: oh, you. in general, please don't assume Macs ever behave like anything else.	16:11
cmurf	I don't ever assume such craziness.	16:12
adamw	has anyone yet tested writing TC4/TC5 to actual silver disc and booting it EFI on a non-mac?	16:12
* j_dulaney has no EFI h/w		16:12
* nirik neither.		16:13
spot	adamw: there isn't too much non-mac EFI around, matthew might have some	16:13
adamw	if not, let's leave it open to testing. the test is in the matrix anyway.	16:13
adamw	spot: i have one. i think satellit does.	16:13
* tflink does as well		16:13
spot	i stand corrected.	16:13
adamw	#action adamw and tflink to check status of #810104 with TC5	16:14
adamw	okay, back to...	16:14
adamw	#topic Pending RHBZ upgrade	16:14
adamw	you have the floor, tflink	16:14
tflink	there is an upgrade to RHBZ scheduled for 2012-05-19	16:14
tflink	I probably should have done this earlier, but I started testing stuff against the staging instance to make sure that stuff doesn't explode	16:15
adamw	because, y'know, it's a great time to do that.	16:15
tflink	at least it's not 2012-05-21 any more	16:15
adamw	Reasons We Need A Fedora Bugzilla, #546633	16:15
tflink	adamw: I hear a volunteer to setup and admin :)	16:16
j_dulaney	LOL	16:16
tflink	anyways, there is breakage	16:16
tflink	there are going to be issues with libreport in released installers	16:16
tflink	but I'm not so worried about that	16:16
tflink	the script that makes the blocker bug wiki page will not work with the new RHBZ	16:16
tflink	neither will the script I use to help with blocker review meetings	16:17
tflink	there are other issues, but those are outside the scope of QA	16:17
nirik	so, we just need to have f17 ready to go before then, right? ;)	16:17
* nirik runs		16:17
kparal	is it hard to update those scripts?	16:17
tflink	my question is - how useful is the blocker wiki page?	16:17
kparal	I use it exclusively	16:18
adamw	pretty useful. though sometimes problematic	16:18
adamw	i found out recently it doesn't cover indirect blockers	16:18
tflink	kparal: jlaska and I poked at it on friday, it won't be a trivial fix	16:18
adamw	i.e. it doesn't list https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=819371 , because it doesn't block f17blocker directly	16:18
tflink	there has been some talk about re-thinking that to be a little more sophisticated	16:18
adamw	you can use custom bugzilla searches to do everything the page does functionally, but it's nowhere near as nice a layout.	16:18
tflink	the wiki page or some replacement, I mean	16:18
brunowolff	I once looked at doing something similar for verified bugs.	16:18
tflink	so my question is - is making sure the wiki page works post RHBZ-upgrade important enough to do instead of some testing?	16:19
tflink	or do we leave it alone for F17 and work on some sort of replacement for F18+	16:19
adamw	the other annoyance with the custom search approach is you have to keep making new searches for alpha, beta, final, next release alpha, beta, final, ad infinitum	16:19
brunowolff	It looked possible to add recursive searching with a postgres backend, but I ended up doing other stuff instead of working on that.	16:19
adamw	tflink: no.	16:20
adamw	tflink: leave it alone until we sign off on f17.	16:20
tflink	adamw: no? to what?	16:20
j_dulaney	tflink: Leave it for f18	16:20
adamw	it's not more important than testing.	16:20
adamw	i can throw up some shared bugzilla searches for f17 final.	16:20
* jskladan is afk for a while		16:20
j_dulaney	tflink: But, yeah, the wiki page is way useful	16:20
kparal	I think it's enough to replace the wiki contents with links to bz queries once rhbz is updated	16:20
tflink	adamw: I know that you think that way - AFAIK, you don't even like the current wiki page	16:20
kparal	and fix it for f18	16:20
adamw	tflink: er, that's not what i said?	16:20
adamw	"<adamw> pretty useful. though sometimes problematic"	16:21
tflink	adamw: ok, I'm mistaken	16:21
brunowolff	Is there going to be an outage during the cut over for a significant amount of time?	16:21
* nirik nods. Shouldn't spend energy on this now, work on f17, _then_ work on fixing it or redoing it.		16:21
tflink	brunowolff: 3 hours are planned	16:21
nirik	brunowolff: it's 3 hours I think	16:21
tflink	ok, works for me. just figured that I would bring it up so it isn't a surprise	16:21
brunowolff	That's not too bad unless it hits a blocker meeting.	16:21
tflink	brunowolff: it won't if we don't slip :)	16:22
tflink	nvm, I misread	16:22
* j_dulaney sees that as unlikely		16:22
tflink	the upgrade is on saturday	16:22
adamw	oh good, i'm scheduled to drink myself into a coma on friday, so no conflicts!	16:23
tflink	so it won't hit the blocker meeting on friday unless it is beyond epic :)	16:23
nirik	yeah, but if we slip we will have no webpage or blockerscript tools... but I hope we can muddle along.	16:23
tflink	nirik: if it's only a week, I can do it by hand	16:23
nirik	yeah.	16:23
adamw	that's how i always used to do it anyway.	16:23
tflink	I/we/whomever	16:23
nirik	and hopefully numbers of bugs would be small.	16:23
j_dulaney	tflink: You've doomed us to an uber blocker meeting	16:23
adamw	right	16:23
* j_dulaney notes that he may not be available for said meeting		16:24
* tflink will ask jlaska to stop running the script after the meeting on friday		16:24
adamw	okay	16:25
adamw	i'll put together some saved searches and send out a mail or something	16:25
tflink	we'll figure out what we want to do post F17	16:25
tflink	hopefully bodhi will work with the new RHBZ :)	16:26
nirik	yeah, lmacken is going to be doing testing with it this week.	16:27
nirik	hopefully no big issues.	16:27
tflink	yeah, I'm hoping that isn't going to be a problem	16:27
tflink	but considering what we were hitting on friday, I'm not sure how likely it is :'(	16:27
j_dulaney	Why, oh why, are they doing it at this point in the release cycle?	16:28
tflink	ok, that's all I wanted to bring up	16:28
adamw	okay.	16:29
adamw	j_dulaney: note that it's bugzilla.redhat.com .	16:29
tflink	j_dulaney: the original F17 release was supposed to have happened already :)	16:29
adamw	oh, and that.	16:29
adamw	okay	16:29
adamw	we did open floor already	16:29
adamw	but let's just re-check	16:30
tflink	adamw: nirik had something for open floor	16:30
adamw	oh, and log that section	16:30
nirik	oh yeah...	16:30
adamw	#info Bugzilla will be upgraded to 4.2 on 2012-05-19	16:30
adamw	#info this may cause problems for bug reporting from anaconda in older releases, and will break our 'current release blockers' wiki page and blocker meeting helper scripts	16:30
adamw	#action adamw to create some shared bugzilla searches for F17 final blocker/nth to replace the wiki page	16:31
adamw	#info tflink will look into options for the broken tools once f17 is signed off	16:31
adamw	#topic Open floor	16:31
brunowolff	I notice that bugmail is now going to come in html by default. I'll be turning that off (html) right away.	16:31
adamw	what's up, nirik?	16:31
nirik	so, I thought I would mention to QA folks: I was looking at updating boot.fedoraproject.org... it's been on my list for a long time. http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/infrastructure/2012-May/011721.html we can back it out if it causes problems easily. I don't know how many people use b.fp.o. There is no release critera affected.	16:31
tflink	brunowolff: wait, what? really? damnation, I'll have to change that option, too	16:32
nirik	but perhaps down the road we should add it to critera, etc.	16:32
nirik	brunowolff: ? yuck	16:32
adamw	nirik: yeah, it's like EC2 at present, not covered but probably should be.	16:32
brunowolff	http://www.bugzilla.org/releases/4.2/release-notes.html#v42_feat_email	16:32
tflink	adamw: isn't EC2 covered?	16:32
nirik	anyhow, wanted to mention it, and get any feedback about it... and testing would of course be welcome after it's switched.	16:33
tflink	as final - the Xen release criteria	16:33
adamw	tflink: well, sorta indirectly, yeah.	16:33
j_dulaney	nirik: Propose a test day	16:33
tflink	adamw: EC2 was the reason we wrote that criterion, though	16:33
adamw	that criterion probably wouldn't cover just some kind of error in our EC2 applicance image, though. well, burn that bridge when we get to it.	16:34
adamw	not entirely. ec2 is one of the major reasons we accepted the principle of xen being a final blocker.	16:34
j_dulaney	BURNING BRIDGES!	16:34
adamw	but that was more 'use of fedora on ec2' than 'use of any specific image fedora project releases for ec2'	16:34
* j_dulaney is a pyro		16:34
nirik	j_dulaney: sure...	16:34
adamw	anyhow...we're way over time	16:34
brunowolff	That's a good song.	16:34
adamw	#info nirik will be updating boot.fedoraproject.org for F17, he welcomes input and testing	16:35
nirik	ipxe should add lots of more hardware support, FYI.	16:35
nirik	and some wireless even	16:35
adamw	oh yay.	16:36
adamw	okay...so, anything else? last call!	16:36
* nirik has nothing		16:36
adamw	well FINALLY you're satisfied	16:37
adamw	:P	16:37
nirik	:)	16:37
adamw	thanks for coming, all	16:37
adamw	time to go bash some blockers	16:37
adamw	#endmeeting	16:37

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