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< BugZappers | Meetings
Bug Triage Meeting :: 2009-06-02
Agenda: https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-test-list/2009-June/msg00076.html
Attendees
- adamw
- arxs
- iarlyy
- thomasj
- poelcat
- SMParrish
Meeting Recap
- Triage Metrics - http://publictest14.fedoraproject.org/triageweb/
The metrics are now in beta. Bug reports and RFE's should be posted here http://fedorahosted.org/triage
Code http://git.fedorahosted.org/git/triage.git
proposal for FAS changes - New bugzappers to apply to 'triagers', and for that to be automatically linked to 'fedorabugs', making 'triagers' group an accurate record of our actual bugzappers membership. This has been forwarded to the FAS admins.
- Severity/priority - http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Beland/
Awaiting changes to bugzilla before going officially into effect. See https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=495985
BugZappers can begin to set the severity field on bugs reported to rawhide.
- Open Floor
arxs discussed the addition of https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=459323 to the common bugs page. It was agreed it should be added which arxs will do.
SMParrish brought up a very good suggestion for fellow triagers. Full information here: https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-test-list/2009-June/msg00149.html
IRC Transcript
| adamw | bugzappers meeting time - show of limbs | 08:01 |
|---|---|---|
| * poelcat here | 08:01 | |
| * arxs hands up | 08:01 | |
| * thomasj here | 08:02 | |
| adamw | anyone else? | 08:02 |
| adamw | let's give iarlyy a minute... | 08:03 |
| adamw | ach,well, that's long enough! | 08:04 |
| adamw | alright, topic #1: triage metrics | 08:04 |
| adamw | comphappy has a final today so i shall do my finest comphappy impression once again | 08:04 |
| * SMParrish here | 08:04 | |
| adamw | heya | 08:05 |
| adamw | alright, so, the main news: the metrics system is basically all up and running | 08:05 |
| adamw | it's now running on live data, not test snapshots | 08:05 |
| adamw | so this is now the 'beta' period: comphappy wants people to be using it, and filing reports on any problems they find | 08:06 |
| adamw | bugs to be filed at fedorahosted.org/triage | 08:06 |
| adamw | so, big vote of thanks to comphappy for being awesome and making that for us. alright. anyone else on this topic? | 08:07 |
| poelcat | adamw: file bugs :) | 08:07 |
| * poelcat goes to find url | 08:07 | |
| arxs | http://publictest14.fedoraproject.org/triageweb/ | 08:07 |
| poelcat | http://fedorahosted.org/triage | 08:08 |
| adamw | thanks | 08:08 |
| poelcat | click on "new ticket" and component = triageweb | 08:08 |
| adamw | right | 08:09 |
| adamw | so please do be playing with the system, and file reports for any problems or ideas you have | 08:09 |
| poelcat | what is our target "go live" date? | 08:09 |
| * poelcat wasn't sure if it changed or not | 08:10 | |
| adamw | well, it's a bit of a dubious distinction now because we may as well start using it to generate useful data now - it was always intended more for us to track our own numbers than to be something for 'the public' - but I think comphappy said the beta period would end as far as he and infrastructure are concerned early next month | 08:10 |
| poelcat | okay, i wasn't clear if we were collecting "real data" or just enough to test it | 08:11 |
| adamw | nope, it's live on the real bz data now updated every night, so we may as well use it | 08:11 |
| adamw | welcome iarlyy :) | 08:12 |
| iarlyy | mibbit again, crashing... :@ | 08:12 |
| adamw | alright...i think we covered the metrics | 08:12 |
| adamw | oh, except for one tangential topic: comphappy has a plan to deal with the FAS groups | 08:13 |
| adamw | as we've discussed before, there's a 'triagers' groups and a 'fedorabugs' group within FAS | 08:13 |
| adamw | currently, bugzappers apply to 'fedorabugs' and there's no real set process to get into the 'triagers' group, which isn't used for much | 08:13 |
| adamw | however, 'fedorabugs' contains much more than just bugzappers group members: anyone who needs elevated bz privileges for some reason gets into it | 08:14 |
| adamw | so the proposal is for new bugzappers to apply to 'triagers', and for that to be automatically linked to 'fedorabugs' | 08:14 |
| adamw | then the 'triagers' group would be a good accurate record of our actual bugzappers membership | 08:14 |
| adamw | so...that's the plan :) it seems sound to me, i couldn't fault it. currently it's waiting on the fas admins. | 08:14 |
| adamw | the link to the metric script, btw, is that the metric script uses the 'triagers' group to decide who's a bugzapper. | 08:15 |
| poelcat | adamw: sounds good... i thought comphappy had 'triagers' originally set up for this purpose | 08:15 |
| adamw | i'm not sure what the history is there, but that sounds like the sane way to do it to me anyway | 08:15 |
| poelcat | agree :) | 08:16 |
| iarlyy | adamw: its a great idea.. fully agree | 08:16 |
| adamw | alright, comphappy says he'll be here for next week's meeting so he can give us an update on that then | 08:16 |
| adamw | alright, next topic: priority/severity again (ugh). this is waiting on the bugzilla admins to restrict access to the priority/severity fields | 08:17 |
| adamw | i didn't want to go ahead and put the policy into place until that's done, but it's annoying | 08:17 |
| adamw | it's being handled on a bug report: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=495985 | 08:17 |
| buggbot | Bug 495985: medium, medium, ---, itamar, NEW, [RFE ] Hide Severity/Priority field from everyone except the maintainer/developer | 08:17 |
| adamw | so I'm just twiddling my thumbs waiting on that at present :\ | 08:17 |
| arxs | well, i started to set the severity only on rawhide bugs, and sometime i need to adjust down the severity who are set by the user. And no severity war was happend :) | 08:18 |
| adamw | arxs: hah! vindication! | 08:19 |
| adamw | that's great, thanks for doing that | 08:19 |
| adamw | i think everyone could certainly start doing that if they like, and we'll deal with any unholy revision wars if any actually happen | 08:20 |
| adamw | anyone else started using severity yet? | 08:20 |
| adamw | well, er, feel free to. :) | 08:21 |
| iarlyy | unfortunately, I have to leave, personal problems, after meeting a read the log. sorry. Back later | 08:21 |
| iarlyy | ***I read | 08:21 |
| adamw | alright, cya iarlyy, hope it's nothing bad | 08:21 |
| adamw | anyone have anything to add on severity? | 08:22 |
| poelcat | adamw: way to make it happen! | 08:22 |
| adamw | alright, then - on to open floor | 08:23 |
| arxs | yes, nouveau and hibernate/standby offent not working, is this a information who should add to the common bugs wiki page? | 08:23 |
| adamw | arxs: it's not specific enough; we need a definite indication of exactly what the scenario is, ideally | 08:24 |
| adamw | what bug #(s) are you thinking of? | 08:24 |
| arxs | yust give me a second :) | 08:25 |
| adamw | alright :) | 08:25 |
| * adamw whistles | 08:26 | |
| poelcat | one thing from me... | 08:26 |
| adamw | yep? | 08:27 |
| poelcat | i'd like to see if some other folks would be willing to run the meetings going forward | 08:27 |
| arxs | for example bug 459323 (i know, the bug is old and reported against f10) | 08:27 |
| buggbot | Bug https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=459323 high, medium, ---, bskeggs, ASSIGNED, nvidia video card: X does not resume after suspend | 08:27 |
| * poelcat will wait until we're done disucssing the bug | 08:27 | |
| adamw | arxs: hmm, i see, so on quite a lot of hardware... | 08:28 |
| adamw | that probably is worth documenting. it'd be nice to have more details and/or a workaround though :| | 08:28 |
| adamw | arxs: please do add an entry to the common bugs page for it yeah, thanks for bringing it up...i hadn't seen that report | 08:29 |
| arxs | i have the same problem with my Nvidia cards, the nv dirver works, but the nouveau not | 08:29 |
| arxs | adamw: ok, should i also changed the bug to report against rawhide? | 08:29 |
| adamw | that's a tricky one, i always hate this situation - bugzilla just doesn't handle it right :\ | 08:30 |
| adamw | probably, it'd likely get more attention that way. note in a comment that it does affect 10 as well, still, though. | 08:30 |
| adamw | i'll try and find Ben and talk to him about the problem too, see if he can explain anything. | 08:30 |
| arxs | and also f9, since the bug was change in past from f9 to f10 | 08:30 |
| adamw | yeah, though i doubt any fixes could be easily backported that far. but yep, worth noting | 08:31 |
| adamw | thanks a lot - let me know if you have any questions about adding stuff to the page | 08:31 |
| arxs | ok, thanks for your hints | 08:32 |
| arxs | thats all from me, back to poelcat ? | 08:32 |
| adamw | yeah | 08:32 |
| poelcat | i need to focus my time on some other projects | 08:32 |
| adamw | poelcat: tk009 has been helping out with running them lately, which is great | 08:32 |
| poelcat | tk009 has done a fantastic job helping to lighten the load by creating the agenda and doing the recap | 08:32 |
| poelcat | but I still need a break :) | 08:32 |
| poelcat | i still want to be involved with triage, but more in a background role and probably not be at all the meetings | 08:33 |
| poelcat | i'll still handle the "housekeeping" tasks for F11 and F12 and beyond that we'll see | 08:33 |
| adamw | well thanks for all you've done | 08:33 |
| poelcat | you're welcome :) | 08:33 |
| adamw | so, for now we have me and tk009 in the meeting management committee =) anyone else like to join? | 08:34 |
| i-amin | hmmm | 08:34 |
| arxs | maybe me, i have some spare time, but i'm not a native english speaker at all | 08:34 |
| adamw | that's OK | 08:35 |
| adamw | well, we'll just take it as it goes from now on, i think we should have people enough to cover things | 08:35 |
| SMParrish | I know we have some housekeeping coming up to rebase rawhide to F11 and F9 open to F10 correct | 08:35 |
| adamw | SMParrish: yep, poelcat is in charge of that | 08:35 |
| i-amin | sorry for interupting | 08:36 |
| adamw | np | 08:36 |
| i-amin | may i know what this room is all about?? | 08:36 |
| SMParrish | Ok. one thing I am going to do is go through all open F9 KDE issues and if I find it is an issue still in Rawhide I'm going to manually rebase them to F11, that way they stay at the top of our list. Might want to suggest other triagers do the same | 08:37 |
| thomasj | i-amin, /topic ;) | 08:37 |
| adamw | SMParrish: that's a good idea - everyone take note :) | 08:37 |
| i-amin | owh | 08:37 |
| i-amin | okk | 08:37 |
| adamw | SMParrish: you could send a mail to the list suggesting it also | 08:37 |
| SMParrish | I'll do that. | 08:38 |
| arxs | i have many open bugs with NM for F9 who are all waiting for NEEDINFO for more then 60 days, should i closed it manuell or leave it and let the EOL tasks do the work? | 08:39 |
| adamw | poelcat? | 08:39 |
| SMParrish | arxs: I always close this as INSUFFICIENT_DATA and tell the reporter to reopen when they have the requested info | 08:40 |
| poelcat | hm | 08:40 |
| poelcat | probably nicer to give the "personal touch" of closing them yourself | 08:41 |
| arxs | SMParrish: yeah, thanks for the info, thats the same that i do on f10 bugs. But if the F9 bugs gets closed by EOL it's clearer for the reporter the the issuse can't be reopen | 08:41 |
| arxs | poelcat: ok, thats make round about 20 bugs less for EOL tagging :) | 08:41 |
| adamw | well, you can close them with a message saying to only re-open if they can reproduce on a _later release_ | 08:41 |
| poelcat | adamw: yes, great point! | 08:42 |
| SMParrish | adamw: good point | 08:42 |
| adamw | the pre-written texts don't have to be strictly adhered to, you could just add a little to it | 08:42 |
| arxs | adamw: thanks for the hint | 08:42 |
| adamw | alright...anything else occur to anyone? | 08:43 |
| arxs | One general question, NM has many bugs in ASSIGN stare who are waiting on NEEDINFO for a long time, is that a task of Bugzappers or the Developer to track them? | 08:44 |
| arxs | s/stare/state | 08:44 |
| adamw | we agreed that it was good for the zappers to do it but not compulsory | 08:44 |
| arxs | ok, i talk to dcbw i've i should help him with it | 08:45 |
| adamw | so if you have time it would be appreciated for you to do what you can to get feedback | 08:45 |
| arxs | maybe one more question :) NM bugs are sometime kernel releated issues, or HAL, oder udev and so on. Sometime i not sure if i could change the component. Therefore, is it a good idea to CC the maintainer of the packages for example? | 08:47 |
| adamw | yes, definitely - if you think it involves another component as well but changing the component wouldn't be appropriate, that's absolutely the right thing to do | 08:47 |
| arxs | I'm a little afraid about it, because i won't spam there with bz mails :) | 08:49 |
| arxs | but ok, i will try this in feature, hope that brings the number of open bugs down :) | 08:49 |
| adamw | it's fine, really, don't worry about doing it :) | 08:50 |
| arxs | any hint who are the best person for kernel related things to CC? | 08:50 |
| adamw | for kernel it's a bit tricky; different people deal with different areas of the kernel | 08:51 |
| adamw | i believe there's an alias to which kernel bugs are usually assigned, i think if you cc that the mail should go to everyone appropriate | 08:51 |
| arxs | it's mostly wlan stuff | 08:51 |
| adamw | can anyone confirm? poelcat? | 08:51 |
| adamw | wlan stuff is usually John Linville | 08:51 |
| adamw | linville@redhat | 08:51 |
| arxs | i have seen that the intellinuxwireless BZ page is not in the "upstream" bugs list | 08:53 |
| adamw | yeah, it doesn't have everything | 08:53 |
| arxs | should i open a bug against bugzilla as RFC ? | 08:53 |
| adamw | i think you can file a feature request in bz itself to have that added | 08:53 |
| poelcat | i could be wrong, but i think kernel puts most things to a list | 08:53 |
| poelcat | actually there are a couple of pages about triaging kernel stuff | 08:54 |
| poelcat | KernelBugTriage | 08:54 |
| adamw | yeah, that says linville for wireless stuff | 08:55 |
| poelcat | should probably be in triage category | 08:55 |
| adamw | it's rather old and of uncertain provenance though :) | 08:55 |
| adamw | yeah it should be merged into some of our existing pages i think | 08:55 |
| poelcat | check with the kernel team, i believe they did most of those pages | 08:56 |
| arxs | poelcat: thanks for the link | 08:56 |
| adamw | and yeah, always ask if you're unsure | 08:57 |
| adamw | kernel team has a channel - #fedora-kernel | 08:57 |
| poelcat | sort of related, but a real good one KernelCommonProblems | 08:57 |
| adamw | so you can pop in there and ask if you need their input on something but you're not sure who to cc | 08:57 |
| adamw | well, i think it's about wrap-up time | 08:58 |
| adamw | thanks for coming everyone | 08:59 |
| arxs | thanks for all your hints | 08:59 |
| adamw | triage day in -bugzappers now! | 09:00 |
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