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Attendees

People present (lines said):

  1. jlaska (132)
  2. adamw (42)
  3. kparal (32)
  4. tflink (14)
  5. maxamillion (9)
  6. robatino (6)
  7. brunowolff (4)
  8. jsmith-busy (1)
  9. vhumpa (1)

Unable to attend:

  1. Rhe (hopefully sleeping)
  2. Hongqing (hopefully sleeping)
  3. Twu (hopefully sleeping)
  4. Jskladan

Agenda

Previous meeting follow-up

  1. COMPLETED - adamw reached out to rdieter for status of 684846
  2. COMPLETED - jlaska - reach out to mgracik for input on 696320 - https://admin.fedoraproject.org/updates/firstboot-1.118-1.fc15
  3. COMPLETED - jlaska - add https://admin.fedoraproject.org/updates/imsettings-1.2.2-1.fc15 to F15-TC1 rel-eng ticket - more on this later
  4. COMPLETED - jlaska - test 700085 using an updates.img prior to Final TC1 - just tested ... looks good

F-15-Final-TC1 status

  • STATUS: INPROGRESS -- see rel-eng#4685
  • TC1 expected to arrive later today
  • Continue to monitor for blocker bugs at Current_Release_Blockers
  • Robatino will send TC1 ISO announcements to test-announce@. Final-TC1 testing will be recorded on the wiki at
  • The team conducted a *mini* review of 2 proposed blocker bugs ...
    1. AGREED: 700967 - AcceptedBlocker - Impacts basic application functionality for s-c-lang when run by KDE
    2. AGREED: 696278 - Continue traiging - Still unclear on the exact cause, and the exact failure. Requested additional logs from reporters, preupgrade is planned for testing against TC1

AutoQA update

Upcoming QA events

  1. Monday, May 02 (TODAY) - Final TC1 testing starts
  2. Friday, May 06 - Final blocker review meeting
  3. Wednesday, May 11 - Final Candidate testing starts
  4. Tuesday, May 17 - Go/NoGo meeting

Open Discussion - <your topic here>

  • Robatino expressed concerns about gnome-session-saving support for users upgrading from F14->F15. Jlaska and Robatino agreed to focus additional testing and review results in #fedora-qa
  • tflink and adamw discussed the Cloud SIG test day, tflink will follow-up with the Cloud SIG for an event recap

Action items

  1. tflink to follow-up with cloud sig for test day recap

IRC Log

jlaska #startmeeting Fedora QA Meeting 14:59
zodbot Meeting started Mon May 2 14:59:54 2011 UTC. The chair is jlaska. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 14:59
zodbot Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic. 14:59
jlaska #meetingname fedora-qa 14:59
zodbot The meeting name has been set to 'fedora-qa' 14:59
jlaska #topic Roll Call 15:00
* kparal first 15:00
jlaska Happy Monday all ... anyone lurking for the QA meeting? 15:00
* brunowolff is here 15:00
jlaska Hi kparal and brunowolff 15:00
* tflink is here 15:00
* jlaska tips hat to tflink 15:01
* jlaska surprised to see vhumpa 15:01
jlaska will wait a few more minutes ... 15:01
jlaska robatino: are you available for the meeting? 15:02
* robatino here 15:02
jlaska yay! 15:02
* jsmith-busy lurks 15:03
jlaska okay, well ... let's get moving. I'm not sure if adamw will be with us today, and I'm sure jskladan is lurking 15:03
adamw yo 15:03
adamw oooh, i'm a ghost! 15:03
jlaska cool, already you are here :) 15:03
jlaska welcome back 15:04
jlaska #topic Previous meeting follow-up 15:04
kparal jlaska: jskladan regrets but can't attend 15:04
jlaska kparal: okay, thanks. Hope all is well 15:04
jlaska We didn't gather for a meeting last week ... so I don't have any action items 15:04
jlaska but there were a few items from the Friday blocker review 15:04
jlaska #info adamw reached out to rdieter for status of 684846 - COMPLETED 15:05
jlaska and there is a new selinux-policy available for testing, score! 15:05
jlaska #info jlaska - reach out to mgracik for input on 696320 - COMPLETED - https://admin.fedoraproject.org/updates/firstboot-1.118-1.fc15 15:06
jlaska #info jlaska - add https://admin.fedoraproject.org/updates/imsettings-1.2.2-1.fc15 to F15-TC1 rel-eng ticket - COMPLETED - more on this later 15:06
tflink is that the same selinux-policy that's failing depcheck right now? 15:06
jlaska #info jlaska - test 700085 using an updates.img prior to Final TC1 - COMPLETED - just tsted ... looks good 15:06
jlaska tflink: sounds like you're more up to speed on that 15:06
jlaska That's all I have on my list ... any other outstanding items from last week? 15:07
jlaska alright, moving on ... 15:07
jlaska #topic F-15-Final-TC1 status 15:07
jlaska According to the schedule, Final TC1 should be arriving sometime today 15:08
jlaska #link http://rbergero.fedorapeople.org/schedules/f-15/f-15-quality-tasks.html 15:08
jlaska I didn't see any Final rel-eng tickets yet, so I created 2 so we can track any bodhi updates that need to be included 15:08
jlaska #link https://fedorahosted.org/rel-eng/ticket/4685 15:08
jlaska and ... 15:08
jlaska #link https://fedorahosted.org/rel-eng/ticket/4686 15:09
adamw cool 15:09
jlaska adamw: I *think* I got all the items we noted from last Friday .. but lemme know if I missed any 15:09
jlaska if these tickets get closed or dup'd by any autogenerated ones, let's just make sure the list of updates is fwd'd 15:09
jlaska I still need to catch up with clumens for a anaconda-15.30-1 build, but I know he's already started the process on his end 15:10
jlaska the blocker list seems to have cleaned up well since Friday 15:10
jlaska #link Current_Release_Blockers 15:10
maxamillion bah! ... Re: Roll Call - /me is here 15:10
jlaska Hi maxa :) 15:10
adamw you're late, stand in the corner 15:10
jlaska we have 2 proposed items ... any objections if we attempt to knock those out here (*quickly*)? 15:11
jlaska #link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=700967 15:11
jlaska ^^^ seems pretty straight forward 15:11
jlaska This appears to impact the final criteria "All applications listed under the Applications menu or category must start successfully" 15:12
jlaska and this is for KDE ... which does qualify as a blocker I believe 15:12
adamw sure 15:12
jlaska any comments/objections? 15:12
jlaska +1 Blocker for that 15:12
adamw +1 15:12
* maxamillion stands in the corner in shame 15:13
maxamillion +1 15:13
maxamillion (from the corner) 15:13
jlaska #agreed 700967 - AcceptedBlocker - Impacts basic application functionality for s-c-lang when run by KDE 15:13
jlaska adamw: I'll note in the bz post-meeting 15:13
adamw ok 15:13
jlaska #link https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=696278 15:13
jlaska I don't feel any closer to understanding this issue 15:14
jlaska I've got a preupgrade test inprogress, so we'll see 15:14
jlaska but still no idea what the root cause is here 15:14
jlaska adamw: any brilliant ideas on your end? 15:14
brunowolff +1 for 700967 as well (I was reading it while you guys were voting) 15:14
adamw reading 15:15
jlaska brunowolff: noted, thank you 15:15
adamw oh, that one 15:15
jlaska yeah :( 15:15
adamw well no, i had no real idea before and i don't now 15:15
adamw it's worth noting that we only guarantee upgrades from _clean install_ 15:15
adamw "The installer must be able to successfully complete an upgrade installation from a clean, fully updated default installation (from any official install medium) of the previous stable Fedora release, either via preupgrade or by booting to the installer manually. " 15:15
adamw we don't really guarantee any upgrade from a 'real' working system; it's just too hard to do 15:16
jlaska definitely 15:16
jlaska I asked for a slew of additional logs from their systems 15:16
adamw so if neither of them hit this on a clean install that could be a -1 15:16
jlaska maybe that'll help us figure out the paths taken 15:16
jlaska and we'll get some good preupgrade testing this week against TC1 ... that'll be informative 15:16
adamw we'd still want to look at getting it fixed, of course, but it might not be a blocker 15:17
adamw yep 15:17
brunowolff It sounds like it could still be NTH if many people might experience this on upgrade. 15:17
adamw brunowolff: sure, could be 15:17
jlaska so ... shall we keep this as is until we can further pinpoint _a_ cause? 15:17
jlaska it sounds like it's still in triage to me ... nothing tangible for a maintainer yet 15:17
jlaska ack/nak/patch? 15:17
maxamillion I think the statement might also mention something about "upgrade not guaranteed in a situation where third party repositories are enabled and any software installed from outside of the official Fedora repositories is not guaranteed to work post-upgrade" 15:18
maxamillion </random_thoughts> 15:18
brunowolff It would be nice to keep an eye on it in blocker discussions until we have a better idea of the cause. 15:18
jlaska brunowolff: right ... I don't think we need to Reject it yet 15:18
tflink jlaska: ack 15:18
adamw jlaska: ack 15:18
jlaska so I guess the decision is ot keep i on the proposed list for now ... continue monitoring (and hopefully attempting to recreate the failure) 15:18
adamw maxamillion: i'd worry about the precedent of describing a negative case in the criteria 15:18
adamw maxamillion: it could be a slippery slope:) 15:19
adamw writing down all the things that aren't covered would take a while... 15:19
jlaska #agreed 696278 - Continue traiging - Still unclear on the exact cause, and the exact failure. Requested additional logs from reporters, preupgrade is planned for testing against TC1 15:19
maxamillion adamw: good point 15:19
jlaska okay, thanks ... this concludes our mini blocker review 15:20
jlaska I know kparal and vhumpa wanted to experience taste  :) 15:20
maxamillion adamw: I just worry more about unrealistic expectations of users ... but I do agree that the documentation would quickly get overly verbose 15:20
jlaska so ... stay tuned to those rel-eng tickets for when ISO's arrive 15:20
kparal jlaska: thank you :) 15:21
jlaska robatino: will you be doing the wiki updates and announcements, or will that be Tao Wu? 15:21
jlaska kparal: trust me, my pleasure!! :D 15:21
robatino jlaska: afaik it'll be me 15:21
jlaska robatino: okay ... drop me a line if I can help in any way. You've clearly done it before and I think qualify as an expert here :) 15:21
jlaska If no other thoughts on F15-Final-TC1 ... we'll move on 15:22
robatino i'll be fully spelling out "test compose" and "release candidate" in the announcements since there were complaints in the devel list 15:22
adamw robatino: great thinking 15:22
jlaska robatino: heh, sure. I hadn't realized those weren't generally accepted terms. Yeah +good_idea :) 15:22
jlaska Note, TC1 will mark the start of a hectic 2+ weeks 15:23
jlaska I know everyone will do there best to stay on top of bugs, and provide feedback in a timely manner 15:23
jlaska if anything feels stuck or is missing information ... don't hesitate to make noise 15:23
jlaska #topic AutoQA update 15:24
jlaska kparal, also known as the most interesting man in the world ... take it away 15:24
kparal not me, that's our mascot 15:24
kparal http://troll.me/images/the-most-interesting-man-in-the-world/i-dont-always-test-my-code-but-when-i-do-i-do-it-in-production.jpg.pagespeed.ce.rM9YUkz0Br.jpg 15:25
kparal alright 15:25
kparal Here's a short update from the AutoQA world. 15:25
maxamillion kparal: greast poster *EVAR* 15:25
kparal maxamillion: kudos to jlaska 15:25
kparal #info As you might have noticed, we have released AutoQA 0.4.7 last week. 15:25
kparal #link https://kparal.wordpress.com/2011/04/29/autoqa-0-4-7-released/ 15:25
* jlaska does a dance ... nice work team 15:25
kparal We hope that we have finally fixed all problems in depcheck and upgradepath tests and they will produce correct results now. 15:26
kparal In the meantime we have received some complaints about the number of emails AutoQA sends (through Bodhi comments) and the readability of the logs. 15:26
kparal According to tflink's suggestion we have decided to concentrate on those complaints first. Therefore we have wiped all the previous plans for 0.5.0 and started from scratch. 15:26
kparal #info The main topic of the next 0.5.0 release should be "making AutoQA outputs more maintainer-friendly". 15:26
kparal That mainly includes sending less emails and improving contents of our logs. 15:26
adamw sounds like a good idea 15:27
jlaska I trust those changes will be well received by devel@ 15:27
kparal usual call: If anyone has some suggestions related to that, please send your ideas to autoqa-devel@lists.fedorahosted.org. 15:27
kparal And that's all! (in a nutshell) 15:28
jlaska [ OK ] dist-f15 + dist-f15-updates 15:28
jlaska I love that update ... boy, I completely missed that idea a while ago 15:28
adamw i guess you did a quick list based on the feedback received so far already? 15:28
kparal adamw: quick list of what? we have filed some tickets in our Trac according to the feedback 15:29
kparal and we discuss them on autoqa-devel 15:29
jlaska I think discussion of those is still underway? 15:29
kparal yes 15:29
* kparal is just writing one reply 15:29
jlaska or ... there is a tentative meeting scheduled for this week? 15:29
jlaska s/or/and/ 15:29
adamw kparal: quick list of ideas 15:30
tflink yeah, we're waiting on scheduling feedback for that one 15:30
adamw so the answer's yes :) 15:30
kparal jlaska: we just agreed with tflink we could have conference call tentatively on wednesday. depends on jskladan 15:30
kparal adamw: yes :) 15:30
kparal we don't want to fail our maintainers, that's our user base :) 15:31
jlaska anything else exciting on the AutoQA front? 15:31
jlaska seems like autoqa-0.4.7 went off without a glitch ... nicely done all 15:32
kparal I think that's all from this weel 15:32
kparal *week 15:32
jlaska okay, many thanks kparal tflink vhumpa jskladan :) 15:32
kparal jlaska: well, production testing seems to be working 15:32
kparal and jlaska 15:32
jlaska so, the only other thing I had on the agenda was a quick schedule reminder ... 15:32
jlaska #topic Upcoming QA events 15:33
jlaska #info Monday, May 02 (TODAY) - Final TC1 testing starts 15:33
jlaska #link http://rbergero.fedorapeople.org/schedules/f-15/f-15-quality-tasks.html 15:33
jlaska #info Friday, May 06 - Final blocker review meeting 15:33
jlaska I won't be available for the last scheduled blocker meeting this Friday ... but I can still send out the announcement etc... 15:33
jlaska we can coordinate as we get closer to ensure someone will be around 15:33
jlaska if not ... kparal can host from a pub or something! :D 15:34
adamw i'll be around 15:34
adamw (i think) 15:34
jlaska heh, okay ... we can work out the details later in the week 15:34
jlaska #info Wednesday, May 11 - Final Candidate testing starts 15:35
jlaska #info Tuesday, May 17 - Go/NoGo meeting 15:35
jlaska so that's 2+ weeks until the go/no_go 15:35
jlaska that'll go *fast* 15:35
jlaska any thoughts/questions/haiku? 15:35
jlaska if not ... we'll move on to the open-mic portion of the show 15:36
adamw prayers? 15:36
adamw :) 15:36
kparal 古池や蛙飛込む水の音ふるいけやかわずとびこむみずのおと 15:36
* vhumpa promises to read the log when he's done with evil JavaEE :-) 15:36
* kparal hopes it is a polite haiku 15:36
jlaska vhumpa: good luck with that beast! 15:36
* tflink shudders ... JavaEE 15:36
jlaska kparal: boy, you got me stumped on that one 15:37
tflink kparal: my japanese is a bit rusty but it looks OK to me 15:37
kparal ok, I admit, I copied that from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haiku#Examples 15:38
adamw kparal: that's what SHE said 15:38
kparal :) 15:38
jlaska adamw: LOL!! 15:38
jlaska good times in the land of Fedora QA  :) 15:38
jlaska #topic Open Discussion - <your topic here> 15:38
jlaska I think we've moved on this this #topic already :) 15:38
* adamw realizes 'that's what she said' is weirdly difficult to render in japanese 15:38
jlaska any business not already discussed that we need to consider? 15:38
adamw did we review the cloud test days? 15:39
jlaska robatino: Viking-Ice: anything items/concerns from you as we prepare for TC1? 15:39
tflink not that I'm aware of 15:39
robatino jlaska: session saving in upgrades 15:39
adamw there's a fix for that coming down the pipe afaik 15:40
tflink do we usually do the test day review or the group involved? 15:40
jlaska robatino: I saw your feedback in that bz ... I'll be sure to test that as well. While I did experience that random black background ... it seems to save the session and no longer hang on login anymore 15:40
adamw tflink: well, we usually just mention it in a meeting. the people running the test day should do the recap, but i can poke them to make sure it's going to happen 15:40
tflink K, I'll poke them but they're all at JBW this week 15:40
adamw ok 15:40
robatino i'm worried whether people who had it enabled before upgrade will have to struggle with it or it'll work immediately 15:41
adamw it looks like boxgrinder went off well and EC2 was DOA? 15:41
jlaska #info action tflink to follow-up with cloud sig for test day recap 15:41
jlaska tflink: thanks! 15:41
adamw jlaska: info or action? :) 15:41
jlaska adamw: doh, thanks 15:41
tflink yeah, I wasn't able to get any of the EC2 images to work 15:41
jlaska #undo 15:41
zodbot Removing item from minutes: <MeetBot.items.Info object at 0x14bc47cc> 15:41
jlaska #action tflink to follow-up with cloud sig for test day recap 15:41
tflink there has already been an update to BG for some of the issues found during the test day, though 15:41
jlaska robatino: I'll do another upgrade test after the meeting. We can sync up in #fedora-qa afterwards? 15:42
robatino i'll be there 15:42
jlaska re: cloud test day - there aren't a ton of results on the wiki ... but the channel seemed to be active all day long 15:42
jlaska so that seemed fairly positive 15:42
tflink jlaska: yeah, the number of people wasn't a whole lot 15:42
adamw tflink: nice. the testers were external too, right, not just people from the group? 15:42
tflink not sure - might have been from the BG community 15:43
adamw tflink: still counts =) 15:43
adamw jlaska: as long as the results were useful and we get some fixes i'd call that a win 15:43
jlaska #info Robatino expressed concerns about gnome-session-saving support for users upgrading from F14->F15. Will focus additional testing and review results in #fedora-qa 15:43
tflink adamw: there were people I didn't recognize, so if that's what you were asking - yeah 15:44
adamw cool 15:44
jlaska adamw: agreed ... I mentioned to tflink, I was keen on just getting some experience with these components ... not so interested in sheer results 15:44
jlaska s/sheer/number of/ 15:44
jlaska alright ... any other discussion items? 15:45
jlaska #info tflink and adamw discussed the Cloud SIG test day, tflink will follow-up with the Cloud SIG for an event recap 15:45
jlaska alright ... if no other topics ... let's #endmeeting in 1 minute 15:45
jlaska something always feels satisfying about not having a 1+ hour QA meeting 15:46
jlaska we save that for the blocker reviews :D 15:46
jlaska 10 seconds until #endmeeting ... 15:46
jlaska Thanks everyone for your time today! 15:46
jlaska I'll follow-up to the list with minutes 15:47
jlaska Good luck testing these next 2+ weeks 15:47
jlaska #endmeeting 15:47

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