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(Redirected from Understanding RPM Fedora Classroom (2009-02-08))
| ---nirik has changed the topic to: Fedora IRC Classroom - Understanding RPM - The engine behind yum with your teacher Clint Savage (herlo) - See Classroom for tonights schedule of classes. | Feb 07 01:41 | |
| *jds2001 is here | Feb 07 01:41 | |
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| *nirik is here. Hopefull some of the other folks in channel are awake. | Feb 07 01:42 | |
| herlo | Hi all... My name is Clint Savage, I am a Fedora Ambassador in North America and am an experienced Linux Instructor... | Feb 07 01:42 |
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| *mj0vy1 is ready.. | Feb 07 01:42 | |
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| herlo | been teaching linux for 3 years now, have taught for RH (as a contractor) and other companies including IBM, HP, etc... | Feb 07 01:42 |
| *herlo is now down pimping his resume :) | Feb 07 01:42 | |
| herlo | So I'd like to start by talking about RPM, it's basic benefits and why it's important to the world. | Feb 07 01:43 |
| herlo | RPM - Originally stood for Red Hat Package Manager, now dually named RPM Package Manager | Feb 07 01:43 |
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| herlo | is essentially to help manage loads of files, including binaries, configuration and documentations... | Feb 07 01:43 |
| herlo | in one easy way. | Feb 07 01:44 |
| herlo | of course, there are other package management systems. And many distributions use RPM as their package management system. | Feb 07 01:44 |
| herlo | DPKG, that's the Debian way... | Feb 07 01:44 |
| herlo | Ubuntu uses this as well | Feb 07 01:44 |
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| herlo | Ports, from the BSD family | Feb 07 01:44 |
| herlo | Portage is part of the gentoo system | Feb 07 01:45 |
| herlo | there's one called conary, which is pretty new, from the Foresight folks... | Feb 07 01:45 |
| herlo | the benefits of packaging are quite large, but essentially, it makes it easy to contain all the files that belong to a particular application... | Feb 07 01:45 |
| herlo | RPM has a small database (I still believe its berkeley db) | Feb 07 01:46 |
| herlo | located in /var/lib/rpm | Feb 07 01:46 |
| herlo | and each of the files in there are __db.00* which represent the RPM database... | Feb 07 01:46 |
| herlo | which makes it easy for RPM to query and find out what has and hasn't been installed... | Feb 07 01:47 |
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| herlo | there is also the *rpm* command, which is the core functionality of how rpm works... | Feb 07 01:47 |
| herlo | which is what we'll mainly talk about in this class... | Feb 07 01:47 |
| herlo | rpm can install, verify and query existing packages as well as packages we wish to install. | Feb 07 01:48 |
| herlo | rpm can also fix problems where yum can't and hopefully we'll get a chance to talk about these corner cases | Feb 07 01:48 |
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| herlo | another thing, one that most people don't realize, but rpm can do dependency resolution. | Feb 07 01:48 |
| herlo | and that's a little tricky, but we'll talk about dependency resolution later on... | Feb 07 01:49 |
| herlo | to start off with, I like to talk about rpm and how it can install packages, as well as upgrade and remove packages. | Feb 07 01:49 |
| herlo | then we'll move to querying the database and packages... | Feb 07 01:49 |
| herlo | the simplest way to install a package is to use rpm -i | Feb 07 01:50 |
| herlo | something like this | Feb 07 01:50 |
| herlo | rpm -i zsh-html-4.3.4-8.fc9.i386.rpm | Feb 07 01:50 |
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| herlo | assuming that the rpm database doesn't have zsh-html already installed, it will verify this package and then install all the files associated with this package | Feb 07 01:51 |
| herlo | if you are interested in following along with this package, you can download it at | Feb 07 01:52 |
| herlo | http://herlo.fedorapeople.org/rpms/zsh-html-4.3.4-8.fc9.i386.rpm | Feb 07 01:52 |
| herlo | it is the file that is also included in the current F10 base repository... | Feb 07 01:52 |
| herlo | doing that install yields pretty much no output | Feb 07 01:53 |
| herlo | and the package is in stalled | Feb 07 01:54 |
| herlo | but the real question is what does that benefit us... | Feb 07 01:54 |
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| herlo | and it's really simple, we now have the documentation for the zshell installed. | Feb 07 01:54 |
| herlo | how do we erase an rpm? | Feb 07 01:55 |
| herlo | well, that's rpm -e | Feb 07 01:55 |
| herlo | prety straightforward as well, but there is one catch, let's try that now... | Feb 07 01:55 |
| herlo | # rpm -e zsh-html-4.3.4-8.fc9.i386.rpm | Feb 07 01:55 |
| herlo | error: package zsh-html-4.3.4-8.fc9.i386.rpm is not installed | Feb 07 01:55 |
| herlo | hmm, I wonder why that happened :) | Feb 07 01:55 |
| herlo | any thoughts? | Feb 07 01:55 |
| brunowolff | .rpm | Feb 07 01:56 |
| herlo | brunowolff: dig a little deeper there, you're right | Feb 07 01:56 |
| herlo | the .rpm implies that we're trying to uninstall the rpm file, it's not what we ant | Feb 07 01:56 |
| herlo | want | Feb 07 01:56 |
| herlo | instead, what we want is | Feb 07 01:56 |
| herlo | # rpm -e zsh-html-4.3.4-8.fc9.i386 | Feb 07 01:57 |
| herlo | and that will erase the package | Feb 07 01:57 |
| herlo | but this would also work | Feb 07 01:57 |
| herlo | # rpm -e zsh-html-4.3.4-8.fc9 | Feb 07 01:57 |
| herlo | and this | Feb 07 01:57 |
| herlo | # rpm -e zsh-html-4.3.4-8 | Feb 07 01:57 |
| herlo | and this | Feb 07 01:57 |
| herlo | # rpm -e zsh-html | Feb 07 01:57 |
| herlo | because the way that rpm works, versioning is based upon several things | Feb 07 01:57 |
| herlo | the version 4.3.4-8 | Feb 07 01:57 |
| herlo | the release fc9 | Feb 07 01:57 |
| herlo | the architecture i386 | Feb 07 01:58 |
| herlo | you'll find that there is only one zsh-html package and normally this is what you want... | Feb 07 01:58 |
| herlo | I can also install or upgrade an rpm package... | Feb 07 01:58 |
| VileGent | ? cant we install with http as well | Feb 07 01:58 |
| herlo | that's rpm -U | Feb 07 01:58 |
| herlo | VileGent: indeed, we're getting there :) | Feb 07 01:59 |
| herlo | VileGent: you can also install over ftp or http actually | Feb 07 01:59 |
| herlo | so that http package I provided earlier would be a good way to go... | Feb 07 01:59 |
| herlo | try this | Feb 07 01:59 |
| herlo | rpm -U http://herlo.fedorapeople.org/rpms/zsh-html-4.3.4-8.fc9.i386.rpm | Feb 07 01:59 |
| mj0vy1 | ! | Feb 07 01:59 |
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| herlo | mj0vy1: please go ahead :) | Feb 07 01:59 |
| mj0vy1 | When I install, I am getting this error "Header V3 DSA signature: NOKEY, key ID 4ebfc273", but it installs eventually | Feb 07 02:00 |
| herlo | mj0vy1: that's not an error, but we'll talk aobut that a little further on | Feb 07 02:00 |
| mj0vy1 | ok | Feb 07 02:00 |
| herlo | if I don't cover it, let me know and I'll answer it in the q&a section | Feb 07 02:00 |
| mj0vy1 | alright.. | Feb 07 02:00 |
| herlo | okay, so you've installed and removed a package, let me include one somewhat deprecated option | Feb 07 02:00 |
| herlo | rpm -F | Feb 07 02:01 |
| herlo | -F stands for freshen, or update only | Feb 07 02:01 |
| herlo | it allowed administrators to run an rpm -F *rpm and *only* upgrade packages that are installed on the system | Feb 07 02:01 |
| brunowolff | Deprecated? | Feb 07 02:01 |
| herlo | no packages that were in that directory (glob) that weren't already installed would not get installed | Feb 07 02:02 |
| fenris02 | (it should be mentioned that -F views .i386 and .i686 as "the same" so use sparingly) | Feb 07 02:02 |
| brunowolff | Is there some better way to do what it does in rpm? | Feb 07 02:02 |
| herlo | brunowolff: it's still fully functional, but it's been recommended against and isn't that useful | Feb 07 02:02 |
| herlo | brunowolff: no, that's why it's still there | Feb 07 02:02 |
| herlo | fenris02: as does all rpm unless you specify it (iirc) | Feb 07 02:03 |
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| herlo | okay, so for now, pretend that -F is something you use sparingly as fenris02 pointed out :) | Feb 07 02:03 |
| herlo | a couple other switches that are handy, -v verbose -h hash marks | Feb 07 02:03 |
| herlo | so try this | Feb 07 02:03 |
| herlo | rpm -e zsh-html | Feb 07 02:04 |
| herlo | rpm -Uvh http://herlo.fedorapeople.org/rpms/zsh-html-4.3.4-8.fc9.i386.rpm | Feb 07 02:04 |
| herlo | rpm -Uvh http://herlo.fedorapeople.org/rpms/zsh-html-4.3.4-8.fc9.i386.rpm | Feb 07 02:04 |
| herlo | Retrieving http://herlo.fedorapeople.org/rpms/zsh-html-4.3.4-8.fc9.i386.rpm | Feb 07 02:04 |
| herlo | Preparing... ########################################### [100%] 1:zsh-html ########################################### [100%] | Feb 07 02:04 |
| herlo | as you do this install, you'll notice that there's a new percentage [50%] field and some new hash marks to show the progress | Feb 07 02:05 |
| herlo | these are useful, especially when you are installing many packages at once... | Feb 07 02:06 |
| herlo | I also wanted to mention that if you insall over ftp, it can use globbing, like * or ? in the url | Feb 07 02:06 |
| herlo | so you could do something like this rpm -Uvh 'http://herlo.fedorapeople.org/rpms/zsh*' | Feb 07 02:07 |
| herlo | and if there was zsh and zsh-html packages, it would install both (or upgrade) | Feb 07 02:07 |
| herlo | questions? | Feb 07 02:08 |
| herlo | okay, moving forward... | Feb 07 02:08 |
| brunowolff | Is there a way to update and delete at the same time? | Feb 07 02:08 |
| herlo | in what sense? | Feb 07 02:08 |
| herlo | brunowolff: you want to update one package and remove another? | Feb 07 02:08 |
| brunowolff | Sometimes you need to delete one package in order to install another one, but you can't delete it first because of dependencies. | Feb 07 02:09 |
| brunowolff | Think of handling obsoletes. | Feb 07 02:09 |
| herlo | brunowolff: well, that's a more advanced question, but we'll talk about --force and --nodeps near the end of this conversation... | Feb 07 02:09 |
| herlo | however, there is one point I should make | Feb 07 02:09 |
| fenris02 | if all the deps are provided on the same rpm line, it'll work. | Feb 07 02:09 |
| herlo | right | Feb 07 02:10 |
| herlo | but here's my other point... | Feb 07 02:10 |
| brunowolff | But --force may not work correctly with scripts. It would be nice to do it in one transaction. | Feb 07 02:10 |
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| herlo | brunowolff: let's address that in the q&a because I want to get to your specific request... | Feb 07 02:10 |
| herlo | but there's something else here, when you upgrade a package, the old package is removed and the new installed. | Feb 07 02:11 |
| herlo | okay, so I have two things I need to address at the end :) | Feb 07 02:12 |
| herlo | moving to querying... | Feb 07 02:12 |
| herlo | to start with, let's talk about querying the rpm database and asking for the list of all packages installed | Feb 07 02:12 |
| herlo | rpm -qa | Feb 07 02:12 |
| herlo | I liked to do | Feb 07 02:12 |
| herlo | rpm -qa | wc -l | Feb 07 02:13 |
| herlo | to see how many packages are installed on my machine | Feb 07 02:13 |
| herlo | another thing you can do is | Feb 07 02:13 |
| herlo | rpm -qa '*zsh*' | Feb 07 02:14 |
| herlo | I love to use this to search for any rpms that might match that pattern | Feb 07 02:14 |
| herlo | another thing to look at is just | Feb 07 02:14 |
| herlo | rpm -q | Feb 07 02:14 |
| herlo | # rpm -q zsh-html | Feb 07 02:15 |
| herlo | zsh-html-4.3.4-8.fc9.i386 | Feb 07 02:15 |
| herlo | another is | Feb 07 02:15 |
| herlo | rpm -qi | Feb 07 02:15 |
| herlo | Name : zsh-html Relocations: (not relocatable) | Feb 07 02:15 |
| herlo | Version : 4.3.4 Vendor: Fedora Project | Feb 07 02:15 |
| herlo | Release : 8.fc9 Build Date: Thu 15 May 2008 10:17:38 PM MDT | Feb 07 02:16 |
| herlo | Install Date: Sat 07 Feb 2009 07:03:01 PM MST Build Host: xenbuilder2.fedora.redhat.com | Feb 07 02:16 |
| herlo | Group : System Environment/Shells Source RPM: zsh-4.3.4-8.fc9.src.rpm | Feb 07 02:16 |
| herlo | Size : 2197128 License: BSD | Feb 07 02:16 |
| herlo | Signature : DSA/SHA1, Tue 28 Oct 2008 11:31:09 PM MDT, Key ID bf226fcc4ebfc273 | Feb 07 02:16 |
| herlo | Packager : Fedora Project | Feb 07 02:16 |
| herlo | URL : http://zsh.sunsite.dk/ | Feb 07 02:16 |
| herlo | Summary : Zsh shell manual in html format | Feb 07 02:16 |
| herlo | Description : | Feb 07 02:16 |
| herlo | The zsh shell is a command interpreter usable as an interactive login | Feb 07 02:16 |
| herlo | shell and as a shell script command processor. Zsh resembles the ksh | Feb 07 02:16 |
| herlo | shell (the Korn shell), but includes many enhancements. Zsh supports | Feb 07 02:16 |
| herlo | command line editing, built-in spelling correction, programmable | Feb 07 02:16 |
| herlo | command completion, shell functions (with autoloading), a history | Feb 07 02:16 |
| herlo | mechanism, and more. | Feb 07 02:16 |
| herlo | This package contains the Zsh manual in html format. | Feb 07 02:16 |
| herlo | which provides the package information | Feb 07 02:16 |
| herlo | and rpm -ql | Feb 07 02:16 |
| herlo | rpm -ql zsh-html | Feb 07 02:17 |
| herlo | /usr/share/doc/zsh-html-4.3.4 | Feb 07 02:17 |
| herlo | /usr/share/doc/zsh-html-4.3.4/zsh.html | Feb 07 02:17 |
| herlo | /usr/share/doc/zsh-html-4.3.4/zsh_1.html | Feb 07 02:17 |
| herlo | ... snip ... | Feb 07 02:17 |
| herlo | there's a lot of files listed here... | Feb 07 02:17 |
| herlo | but there's a really cool one I like | Feb 07 02:17 |
| herlo | rpm -qf | Feb 07 02:17 |
| herlo | rpm -qf /bin/bash | Feb 07 02:18 |
| herlo | bash-3.2-30.fc10.i386 | Feb 07 02:18 |
| herlo | so you can do this for any rpm that's installed | Feb 07 02:18 |
| herlo | so try this one.... | Feb 07 02:18 |
| herlo | rpm -qf /bin/ls | Feb 07 02:18 |
| herlo | and you'll find out that it's not in the ls package | Feb 07 02:18 |
| herlo | coreutils-6.12-18.fc10.i386 | Feb 07 02:19 |
| herlo | also, you can check packages that aren't installed | Feb 07 02:20 |
| herlo | rpm -qp | Feb 07 02:20 |
| herlo | rpm -qlp | Feb 07 02:20 |
| herlo | rpm -qip | Feb 07 02:20 |
| herlo | will query the rpm file itself | Feb 07 02:20 |
| herlo | and give similar results to -q, -ql, -qi | Feb 07 02:20 |
| herlo | but for packages | Feb 07 02:21 |
| herlo | moving to answer mj0vy1's question | Feb 07 02:21 |
| herlo | verification... | Feb 07 02:21 |
| herlo | mj0vy1: when you installed your package you got the Header missing error right? | Feb 07 02:21 |
| herlo | that is because you don't have the RPM GPG keys installed... | Feb 07 02:22 |
| herlo | to install your RPM GPG keys, they are automatically provided by Fedora in /etc/pki/rpm-gpg | Feb 07 02:23 |
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| herlo | now, you can also get these from the CD media or right on the actual installed system... | Feb 07 02:23 |
| herlo | to fix that issue, you may wish to run the following | Feb 07 02:24 |
| herlo | rpm --import RPM-GPG-KEY /etc/pki/tls/RPM-GPG-KEY-fedora | Feb 07 02:24 |
| herlo | and any others you'd like to install | Feb 07 02:25 |
| herlo | this will then allow you to verify the packages upon install | Feb 07 02:25 |
| herlo | and you can do that prior to installing the package with | Feb 07 02:26 |
| herlo | rpm -K zsh-html-4.3.4-8.fc9.i386.rpm | Feb 07 02:27 |
| herlo | zsh-html-4.3.4-8.fc9.i386.rpm: (sha1) dsa sha1 md5 gpg OK | Feb 07 02:27 |
| herlo | noting the gpg md5 and everything there is okay | Feb 07 02:27 |
| herlo | you can do this with other rpm gpg keys and import things from other repos too... | Feb 07 02:28 |
| jds2001 | also, note that we're moving to sha256 digests likely in F12. | Feb 07 02:28 |
| herlo | cool | Feb 07 02:29 |
| herlo | jds2001: thanks for that | Feb 07 02:29 |
| herlo | moving to the final stuffs with verification | Feb 07 02:29 |
| herlo | you can use rpm -V to verify a particular package | Feb 07 02:29 |
| herlo | after it's installed | Feb 07 02:29 |
| herlo | if it returns an empty result, it's successful | Feb 07 02:30 |
| herlo | if you get an error, then something is wrong | Feb 07 02:30 |
| brunowolff | Not always. | Feb 07 02:30 |
| nirik | unless it's a config file change. ;) | Feb 07 02:30 |
| brunowolff | Some packages have scripts that modify what they install. | Feb 07 02:31 |
| herlo | good point | Feb 07 02:31 |
| jds2001 | brunowolff: such packages are broken by design :) | Feb 07 02:31 |
| jds2001 | unless it's a config file, obviosuly | Feb 07 02:31 |
| herlo | nirik: pam is a good example of the a config file changing | Feb 07 02:31 |
| brunowolff | Well there are a number of them. I have filed bug reports on some in the past. | Feb 07 02:31 |
| herlo | you can also verify package files, but I have never found a use for this | Feb 07 02:32 |
| herlo | that's done with | Feb 07 02:32 |
| herlo | rpm -Vp | Feb 07 02:32 |
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| herlo | so a couple points to wrap it up then q&a | Feb 07 02:32 |
| herlo | first off, when installing a kernel, never use -U with rpm | Feb 07 02:32 |
| herlo | always use rpm -i or use *yum* | Feb 07 02:33 |
| *herlo points to nirik's presentation | Feb 07 02:33 | |
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| herlo | another thing to talk about, I mentioned that rpm can do dependency resolutoin | Feb 07 02:33 |
| herlo | I read people mentioning that you have to put all the dependencies on one line of an rpm command, this is not true | Feb 07 02:33 |
| herlo | though it's the most common way | Feb 07 02:33 |
| herlo | if you wish to use rpm and do resolution, you'll need to do two basic things... | Feb 07 02:34 |
| *herlo doesn't know what happened to the rpmdb package, but recalls it was merged into rpm or soemthing, jds2001 ?? | Feb 07 02:34 | |
| herlo | and you'll have to create a .rpmmacros file in your home directory | Feb 07 02:34 |
| jds2001 | i dont think so, i think it's gone. | Feb 07 02:35 |
| jds2001 | --aid never worked well anyways :) | Feb 07 02:35 |
| herlo | yeah, it worked fine for me in RHEL4 | Feb 07 02:35 |
| herlo | hmm, well anyway | Feb 07 02:35 |
| herlo | there's the .rpmmacros file | Feb 07 02:35 |
| herlo | %_solve_pkgsdir /path/to/installtree/RedHat/RPMS/ | Feb 07 02:35 |
| herlo | %_solve_name_fmt %{?_solve_pkgsdir}%%{NAME}-%%{VERSION}-%%{RELEASE}.%%{ARCH}.rpm | Feb 07 02:35 |
| jds2001 | yeah, in rhel it's still there i think. | Feb 07 02:35 |
| herlo | add these lines and you can point to the rpm dir and resolve it all | Feb 07 02:36 |
| fenris02 | rpmdb function was replaced by 'yum provides' iirc | Feb 07 02:36 |
| *nirik just thinks it's better to use yum now. ;) | Feb 07 02:36 | |
| herlo | yes, I agree | Feb 07 02:36 |
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| herlo | well, that's good to know about rpmdb | Feb 07 02:36 |
| herlo | so to address the --script question from brunowolff | Feb 07 02:37 |
| herlo | brunowolff: wanna bring that back up again... | Feb 07 02:37 |
| brunowolff | Yes | Feb 07 02:38 |
| brunowolff | The case I am talking about is where you want to replace a package with a different one, such as with obsoletes in yum. | Feb 07 02:39 |
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| brunowolff | If there is a dependency on the package being removed and it conflicts with the one being added it blocks doing the update one step at a time. | Feb 07 02:39 |
| herlo | could you give an example | Feb 07 02:39 |
| herlo | brunowolff: one choice might be --nodeps in that situation?? | Feb 07 02:40 |
| fenris02 | --nodeps and --force are last-resort options that frequently do more harm than good. | Feb 07 02:40 |
| brunowolff | I know I can force it, but if scripts are being run there could be problems. | Feb 07 02:40 |
| *nirik nods at fenris02's comment. | Feb 07 02:40 | |
| fenris02 | --noscripts exists too if that's the issue. | Feb 07 02:41 |
| herlo | fenris02: --nodeps is somethign I use regularly to solve those problems. I'm a big fan of it when it comes to mono packages from OBS | Feb 07 02:41 |
| herlo | fenris02: good catch! | Feb 07 02:41 |
| brunowolff | lately I only do this if something is too broken for yum to handle, so it doesn't come up a lot. | Feb 07 02:41 |
| fenris02 | herlo, they have their use, but are frequently misused ime. | Feb 07 02:41 |
| herlo | fenris02: true, which is why it's discouraged | Feb 07 02:42 |
| brunowolff | No scripts doesn't run the scripts. That is usually even worse. | Feb 07 02:42 |
| herlo | and should be used with great caution | Feb 07 02:42 |
| herlo | any other questions? | Feb 07 02:43 |
| brunowolff | I would have expected to be able to do something like rpm -U packagenew.rpm -e packageold | Feb 07 02:43 |
| herlo | hmm, I don't think that's a good idea either, but I can see your desire... | Feb 07 02:44 |
| fenris02 | brunowolff, if the new package properly has an 'obsoletes: ' tag, that is not necessary | Feb 07 02:44 |
| brunowolff | Really? rpm will automatically remove an obsoleted package? | Feb 07 02:45 |
| fenris02 | brunowolff, yes. | Feb 07 02:45 |
| brunowolff | I thought I'd seen cases in the past when it didn't. | Feb 07 02:45 |
| Falstius | brunowolff: a package can specify packages it replaces even if they don't have the same name. | Feb 07 02:45 |
| fenris02 | brunowolff, if they did not use an obsoletes: tag, it wont | Feb 07 02:45 |
| jds2001 | /win 34 | Feb 07 02:45 |
| herlo | lol | Feb 07 02:45 |
| *herlo has to head, thanks all | Feb 07 02:45 | |
| brunowolff | Maybe what I saw where cases that were missing proper obsoletes definitions and would have broken yum as well. | Feb 07 02:45 |
| nirik | well, I see we are at end of time here... shall we wrap things up? | Feb 07 02:46 |
| herlo | enjoy the discussions... | Feb 07 02:46 |
| nirik | the next class starts in 15min or so... Using Yum - Tricks and tips - Kevin Fenzi (nirik) | Feb 07 02:46 |
| fenris02 | thanks herlo. nicely done. | Feb 07 02:46 |
| nirik | thanks herlo ! | Feb 07 02:46 |
| subfusc | yeah, thanks! it has been interesting to watch! | Feb 07 02:47 |
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